Spot Lights Again

[Medieval Dave]

How the lights on a surf work

Starting from the left/bottom depending how you hold the page. I will refer to the lines as 'rungs' now and again, see how the lines look like rungs of a ladder?

1. The first rung is the main light switch. When you turn it on by twisting the stalk by the wheel, it connects to earth and allows current to flow from the battery, through the relay coil and to earth. this energises the headlamp relay.

There is also a bypass that puts the headlamp relay on when you flash the lights.

2. The second rung is headlamp power: When the headlamp relay has been energised, it allows power to flow from the battery to the headlamp relays and from there to the common of each lamp.

If the switch is in HIGH is shown then current flows through the high filament of each bulb then down through the switch to earth. But (and this is the tricky bit) a small leakage current flows through the dip filaments and on through the high beam indicator lamp on the dash. this route will only allow a small current to flow, enough to light a dash light, but not enough to light the headlamps It's not vital that this bit makes sense, but I spent to much time training apprentices.

If the switch is the other way, in DIP, then there is no earth on the HIGH filaments so they go out. there is no a proper earth on the dip filaments so they come on. and the tricky bit... there is now an earth on BOTH sides of the dash main beam warning light, so no leakage current and that goes out too.

3. The third rung I have shown is the sidelight rung. it is similar but simpler. As you can see the control circuit (through the coil) is a negative switched job again, but tho power side is a conventional positive switch.

When the switch is on then the relay is energised. current flows through the relay then the fuse, then through all the assorted tail, side, no.plate, dash etc lights.

I Hope that makes sense, am glad to try to explian more if I can. sorry the sketch is a bit rough, but I lost patience with it.

When I get my breath back I will post how to tie in fogs and spots and why.

Dave

[BUSHWHACKER]

here's another version.....

[Medieval Dave]

here's another version.....

That's a usefull diagram on the power circuit side, but I was trying to show how the existing control bit works and how to tie into it. I only put the power bit on for 'completeness' because as i said I've spent too much time doing technical training of one sort or another.

[dirtydog]

i cant remember who was asking and cant find the post but if you dont want to mount spots on the A-bar you could mount them onto the bumper as Jotto did and now I've copied him

[BUSHWHACKER]

That's a usefull diagram on the power circuit side, but I was trying to show how the existing control bit works and how to tie into it. I only put the power bit on for 'completeness' because as i said I've spent too much time doing technical training of one sort or another.

Oh, o.k. Sorry Dave, I should have read the whole thread more thoroughly.

[Medieval Dave]

Oh, o.k. Sorry Dave, I should have read the whole thread more thoroughly.

No, can't blame you, I do go on a bit when I get going - it's the teacher in me. Sometimes I read back what I have written, especially doing training stuff for work, and think ' OMG I'm a patronising *******' You should see the way fitters and sparks glaze over when I explain what the project they are working on is actually for...

[Medieval Dave]

HOW TO TAP IN.

I always tap my control supply for lighting relays of the sidelight curcuit, for the following reason:

I you come straigth of the battery, then there is nothing stopping you leaving your spots on when you get out the car, say you've knocked the switch and it's full daylight so you don't see the glare. if your control supply is off the sidelight curcuit then the 'lights on beep' will save you. I always tend to check my lights switch when I get out anyway.

I do not reccomend tapping of your headlamp cicuit though. If you do it means that if your headlamp fuse goes you loose your fogs and spots, where otherwise they could have got you home. If you loose your sidelight circuit but still have your headlights you can do without spots

So I would tap my control current off the sidelight circuit. it is hanging around a few places under the dash on a Green or Green with blue stripe cable on mine, though wiring colours do vary.

I would then use this feed to do the control supply to all my relays, looping it to the coil of each relay. Then I can earth the other end of each relay to turn it on, but only if the sidelights are on.

For fogs that's about it, if the sides are on then current can get as far as the relay coil if the switch is closed (on) then the current can flow all the way to earth. this current flow energises the relay allowing current to flow through the fuse, then the relay contacts then the front fogs.

The spots are a bit more complicated.

From the relay coil you go to a switch, and from there to the high beam curcuit between the lamps and the main beam switch. This is Red with a yellow on my car and lurks on the multiconnector below the steering column. this point is an earth when the lights are in main beam but not otherwise. this means that the spots come on if the sidelights are on and the switch is on and you are in main beam.

Well, that's about it. As the bushwacker points out there are simpler ways, but thats how I like to do it, for the reasons I had said.

Dave

[BUSHWHACKER]

I wired mine exactly as in the diagram, plus my relays have a fuse in the top of them as well.

[POPEYE]

Cheers Guys, I've printed the whole lot, Out for a little elbow bending this
evening so will go through it very carefully tomorrow evening, I appreceiate
the time you are spending on this Dave and dont worry you cannot be too
patronising where im concerned, If you explain it like your talking to a child (or a monkey) that'll do me, Got all the spots fixed to the bar today (dismantled it to make it easer) and powered one up to sort out the wireing,
I'll try not to bother ya too much more, I owe you a few, Cheers, Ian

[dirtydog]

I wired mine exactly as in the diagram, plus my relays have a fuse in the top of them as well.

i really like that A bar in black

[BUSHWHACKER]

Cheers Tim. The chrome was all pitted and dull so I sanded it all smooth, and sprayed it with satin black hamerite.
I sprayed a piece of aluminium angle for the spots instead of drilling the Toyota crossbar.

[POPEYE]

Hi Dave, Guess Who Right Think i've got it through the thick crust,
Just thought i'd run it by you to make sure! It takes some getting my head round this neg switching ,,,OK:-
Take a live feed from the Tail/Side light fuse (mainfuse box, engine bay ?)
From there to pin 86 (Relay type "B" R20B VWP code no),
From pin 85 to Dash switches (looped to all five but only useing three now),
From switches to Red/yellow wire (high beam circuit between lamps & switch)
From one battery via fuse to pin 30 (relay)
From pin 87 to one pair of spots,
Am i ok so far! Only thing im not to sure of is testing the Red/yellow wire,
You say this wire becomes an earth when high beam is switched on so i should test it for earth with a test light ie:- live feed to test probe and earth
clip to Red/yellow and i should get a light when high beam is selected, This
sound right, Just hope mines Red/yellow to,
I've Been reading the posts regarding that headlamp mod useing Relays and
a battery feed to give brighter lights, Dont know what your thoughts are on
it but if i were to do it at a later date would it affect what im doing now?
Might not be worth the aggro,

Oh my head hurts, Cheers Ian

[Medieval Dave]

Hi Dave, Guess Who Right Think i've got it through the thick crust,
Just thought i'd run it by you to make sure! It takes some getting my head round this neg switching ,,,OK:-
Take a live feed from the Tail/Side light fuse (mainfuse box, engine bay ?)
From there to pin 86 (Relay type "B" R20B VWP code no),
From pin 85 to Dash switches (looped to all five but only useing three now),
From switches to Red/yellow wire (high beam circuit between lamps & switch)
From one battery via fuse to pin 30 (relay)
From pin 87 to one pair of spots,
Am i ok so far! Only thing im not to sure of is testing the Red/yellow wire,
You say this wire becomes an earth when high beam is switched on so i should test it for earth with a test light ie:- live feed to test probe and earth
clip to Red/yellow and i should get a light when high beam is selected, This
sound right, Just hope mines Red/yellow to,
I've Been reading the posts regarding that headlamp mod useing Relays and
a battery feed to give brighter lights, Dont know what your thoughts are on
it but if i were to do it at a later date would it affect what im doing now?
Might not be worth the aggro,

Oh my head hurts, Cheers Ian

I believe you are spot on. Sounds like you know how to work a test lamp, so you can check all your connections in advance if you like. You'll find that red and yellow no problem by backpinning it before you cut in (put a paperclip up the connector from the back, then put your test lamp on that) i picked up the fused sidelight feed from under the dash where a green wire does the rounds of the dash lights. again find it by backpinning with a test lamp. this time you are looking for a live so it's easier.

As for modifying the lights to give a decent light from the conventional lights, I think it is a great mod to do for only a few quid. If you do a search you will find there are two ways to do it. one is the technically better way, using four relays, that a couple of guys on here came up with. basically it changes the whole way the loom works to more like what is should have been if toyota had done it properly. If you are carefull it shouldn't matter though, you might just have to change the way you tap into the loom

the other is a kit from the states to fit the relay bit right onto the connector that would otherwise go on the back of the bulb. this means that if you loose a relay whilst out and about, you can just unplug the mod and revert to the origional. This way changes no origional wiring so doesn't affect your spot wiring, and it is what I did myself. it took about an hour. 25 mins to move the batteries, cooling water and washer res out of the way. 10 to do the job. 25 to put things back. Although it is technically less tidy, it is easy and cheap and whilst you are in there you can pop in some super zenon bulbs.

I think you will want to do it one way or the other. I have four spots on the front of mine and although they are just ordinary H3 55w zenons, they get the full 13.8 volts. my heads got about 11volts thanks to the toyota loom and they looked very yellow and just kinda naff by comparison (if you look at photos on here of trucks with the full light rig on you will see what I mean). In fact you are going to want to do this upgrade. trust me.

See pops's thread in the general section 'I WANT TO SEE'. He was doing the mod this very weekend.

I'm looking forwards to seeing pictures with all these lights on, should be quite a sight.

[POPEYE]

Hi, Many thanks, I should be ok now, Ill post some pics when i've got em on,
Might be a little while befor they'r wired got to find about £70 for the bits from VWP, Had a right struggle wireing the spots into the bar i made, Too much wire and not enough bar, The loom coming out each end is about 3/4"
thick,Tried soldering the pairs together but no room and very difficult as the
spot wires go into the bar from the back, You'll see what i mean from the
pics, Anyway so long for now, Ian
Yeah Printed all the stuff by AndyLaLa and Morr, Very interesting, Ian

[Medieval Dave]

Yep, just keep an eye open for how POPS got on with the rockcrawler loom.

Dave