Cracked head, new head, but still won't start

[Gecko]

Ok. Cracked the head in the summer. (my fault, let it over heat too much, I tried to get to services on the motorway.)

Got new head and rebuilt but wouldnt start. So stripped it back down to check timing etc. All was ok.

We have rebuilt engine as far as we need to go to see if it will start and it won't. We have cranked it over and over (flattened 3 batteries so far). There isn't any sound of the engine even trying to fire. It just will not start!!

Timing was done by the book. New head torqued down in sequence as per book. Injectors were also torqued down as per book.

Fuel is getting to the injectors.

Everything was fine until head went.


Any ideas? Anyone had similar experience if so what did you do.

[stormforce]

when i done a head change it took a good 20mins to get the truck to fire up.In the end i had jump leads from my truck to the other and kept turning it over till it fired up

[Gecko]

Was that 20 mins of constant cranking. We give 10 - 15 seconds then stop to give the batteries time to boost up again.

We have had the jump leads from a van and a fast charger thing on the battery.

Maybe I need to give it longer but you can hear the engine cranking slow as the battery wears down.

[Diezel Weazel]

Are ya Glowplugs working ?
n if they are, have ya glowed em up a couple of time before ya try n start it ??

There's always a Payback .. Cos ya don't know where n ya never know when !!

[fatfires]

check how you have refitted the glow plug rail, if the insulators are wrong it wont go, and that the relay is working

[Gecko]

check how you have refitted the glow plug rail, if the insulators are wrong it wont go, and that the relay is working

Can you expand a little on this. There is power to the glow plugs. Relay???

[Koi]

Can you expand a little on this. There is power to the glow plugs. Relay???

Should be fitted like this

This is from the bottom to the top
Blue spacer (raised centre/post)
Wiring connections
Black spacer
Washer
Nut.

Would also check the 80a fuse for the glow plugs

As said above when I replaced my head it took and age to get to fire up. Primed the fuel filter, crack open the fuel line to each injector and turn over til theres fuel present.
On other trucks I have done they started on a few cranks of the engine.

[fatfires]

Should be fitted like this

This is from the bottom to the top
Blue spacer (raised centre/post)
Wiring connections
Black spacer
Washer
Nut.

Would also check the 80a fuse for the glow plugs

As said above when I replaced my head it took and age to get to fire up. Primed the fuel filter, crack open the fuel line to each injector and turn over til theres fuel present.
On other trucks I have done they started on a few cranks of the engine.

As he said!



thanks Nigel

[Gecko]

80 amp fuse is fine (broke the old one trying to get it out). Alot of the spacers are missing/lost but have insulated where needed to stop rail etc... touching where they shouldn't, will this do or do you think I need to get new spacers?

Sorry to keep on about this but I'm at a loss and desparate.

[fatfires]

80 amp fuse is fine (broke the old one trying to get it out). Alot of the spacers are missing/lost but have insulated where needed to stop rail etc... touching where they shouldn't, will this do or do you think I need to get new spacers?

Sorry to keep on about this but I'm at a loss and desparate.

idealy new ones, remember this is a big ish loaded circuit with all the work that has been done do you want to spoil the job for a few quid?? What price peace of mind and reliabillity. You realy do not want loads of amps shorting out

[Gecko]

idealy new ones, remember this is a big ish loaded circuit with all the work that has been done do you want to spoil the job for a few quid?? What price peace of mind and reliabillity. You realy do not want loads of amps shorting out

You are so right. Any idea where I can get them from? Do you think this may be the reason for non starting? Could have ###### done with her this weekend with all the snow!! Cheers.

[fatfires]

You are so right. Any idea where I can get them from? Do you think this may be the reason for non starting? Could have ###### done with her this weekend with all the snow!! Cheers.

stormforce or any of the other breakers on here might have some, roughtrax or possibly Milners for new could be the reason but if you know they are good at least it eliminates that from the equasion

[dannymac]

In my experience of the 2.4 head swaps,yes,as someone mentioned earlier,after a head swap,it can take alot of cranking to get the fuel up with the first start after re assemby,Ive seen myself all but give up one time,only 'easy start' spray saved the day and my sanity lol,another thing to look at is that the glow plugs all work,ive seen these engines refuse to fire because two glow plugs were duds.
If as mentioned before,you connected the glow plug metal connecting strip incorrectly,you will probably have popped the 80amp fuse in the box at the righthand inner wing.
If all this is ok,the next thing to check is your valve clearances,remove the rocker cover and check the clearance with a feeler gauge between the shims ontop of the valves and the cam lobes.A very easy mistake to make when reasembly is to fit theses shims in the wrong place,as they all look the same thickness,but they're not!inlet and exhaust shims are different thickness.A vernier gauge will show you the difference.
If you reused the original valves,did you lap them in?If not it maybe lack of compression due to a poor seat,if you used new valves youll be ok.
But,check your shims first,Im sure thats where your problem is(assuming you have fuel and glowplugs working).These shims can be changed without taking the cam out,toyota used a special tool to compress the springs,chances of finding one is slim though.Its not a major job to take the cam out.

[Gecko]

In my experience of the 2.4 head swaps,yes,as someone mentioned earlier,after a head swap,it can take alot of cranking to get the fuel up with the first start after re assemby,Ive seen myself all but give up one time,only 'easy start' spray saved the day and my sanity lol,another thing to look at is that the glow plugs all work,ive seen these engines refuse to fire because two glow plugs were duds.
If as mentioned before,you connected the glow plug metal connecting strip incorrectly,you will probably have popped the 80amp fuse in the box at the righthand inner wing.
If all this is ok,the next thing to check is your valve clearances,remove the rocker cover and check the clearance with a feeler gauge between the shims ontop of the valves and the cam lobes.A very easy mistake to make when reasembly is to fit theses shims in the wrong place,as they all look the same thickness,but they're not!inlet and exhaust shims are different thickness.A vernier gauge will show you the difference.
If you reused the original valves,did you lap them in?If not it maybe lack of compression due to a poor seat,if you used new valves youll be ok.
But,check your shims first,Im sure thats where your problem is(assuming you have fuel and glowplugs working).These shims can be changed without taking the cam out,toyota used a special tool to compress the springs,chances of finding one is slim though.Its not a major job to take the cam out.

Hello, me again.


Ok, bought new head all built up so didn't reuse old bits etc. Have done checks mentioned above - all ok.

It would appear I have a problem with the fuel supply. When cranking the only smell from exhaust pipe is that of Easy start, no smoke etc... at all. The fuel is getting as far as the injectors (squirting out of injector pipes) could it be the fuel isn't coming out strong enough to push through injector? How far should the fuel squirt when the injector pipe is taken of and the engine is cranked?

Is there a fuel pump in the fuel tank? Didn't seem to be fuel coming up the feed to the fuel filter when we disconnected the feed pipe from the filter and cranked the engine over. Is this because the fuel is sucked up rather than pumped out of the tank?

Where is the stop solonoid? Can't find it and want to check it to eliminate it as the cause of the problem. We found the throttle control and thought that was it. We checked the electrical feed to the throttle control with a lighty up screw drivery type thing and got no reading. Could this be the cause of non starting?

What can i expect the compression in the engine to be (in bar) in an engine of that age?

One other thing to mention. The fuel gauge is reading that the tank is full. I know it isn't as I had done a good 40 miles before she over heated and died.

I'm really sorry to keep on about this but I miss her and want her back (the surf). I really appreciate everyones contribututions to this thread.

Thanks all.

P.S. Does anyone live near West Drayton that is a mastermind on surfs and would love to come and have a look on week end. There'll be as many cups of tea you can drink and a cake or two for any volunteers.

[cfrizzy]

a mate of mine had a surf that wouldnt start after head change and tried everything to get it going but in the end it turned out that it was 180 Degrees
out on the pump timing. now if you think about it when it is like that on the timing marks for the crank it will look ok but it will be injecting on the top of the exhaust stroke. just a thought but could be worth double checking I hope this helps.