New 4X4 sales dropping

[Woodzie]

Todays front page of the times
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...489222,00.html

[BUSHWHACKER]

Todays front page of the times
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...489222,00.html

As soon as I see the term "gas guzzler" it all becomes a load of bo**ocks !

Did you see this quote?.....
“The Chelsea mums used to go for them but they now want something more environmentally friendly, like the Toyota Prius,”




yeah, of course they do, but it's got nothing to do with saving the environment, it's a fashion statement.

[PDR]

Quote: research has shown that someone hit by a 4x4 is more than twice as likely to die than if hit by a saloon car at the same speed. But the vehicles are much safer for their owners: government figures show that drivers of small and medium-sized cars are 50 times more likely to be killed in collisions with another car than drivers of 4x4s.end Quote.

So if you value your life and those of your family then you owe it to yourself to drive a big 4x4. Is wanting to be safe really a selfish choice?

It is obvious that the government wants us all to drive small cars. We would all then be on a level playing field as far impact from other cars is concerned………


But what happens when you are hit by a large "white van", let alone a 38 ton truck.

[andycook]

suppose the benefit of this will be when buying 2nd hand trucks if the prices are dropping, but bad news if selling one...

I wondered why i saw a V8 R-reg disco going so cheap the other day

all the talk of high road duty etc - fails to mention in articles it only applies to newer vehicles!!!
a 1995 4runner/surf has cheaper road tax than a lot of recent smaller vehicles

[Woodzie]

At this rate it would be cheaper to pimp a 2nd or 3rd gen than buy a new 4X4

[dirtydog]

suppose the benefit of this will be when buying 2nd hand trucks if the prices are dropping, but bad news if selling one...

I wondered why i saw a V8 R-reg disco going so cheap the other day

all the talk of high road duty etc - fails to mention in articles it only applies to newer vehicles!!!
a 1995 4runner/surf has cheaper road tax than a lot of recent smaller vehicles

my friends 2.0 beetle is more expensive to tax than the surf.

[AndyLala]

so now you know why there is a shortage of ProComp shocks...

On a more serious note (feeling pretty serious today)
Should these arbitors of fashion, dare I say the impartial voices of common sense dictate research documents incorrectly, they are starting to sound like the BBC...

Don't these references refer to tests that were done that have nothing to do with European 4x4's... didn't I read somewhere that the (American) 'SUV' test was infact a side impact test of a commercial vehicle hitting an SUV...?

Didn't someone (a fireman) on here mention that from their experience that any vehicle travlling over 40mph hitting a pedestrian is more than likely to do considerable damage to the pedestrian regardless of its type.

And, isn't the government shooting itself in the foot. If we all drive environmentally safe vehicles, will it not generate less fuel/car tax as a result?

But as has been said before... what has happened to our freedom of choice? I love my truck, it is the vehicle I enjoy driving and would like to continue to do so. Its rapidly becoming 50% recycled, it would run on SVO it the customs and excise relented, so now who has the greatest environmental footprint?

As an aside, how many of these new 'friendly' vehicles available in the UK that a) you could actually use, b) fit into the lowest tax category, c) would be suitable for a young family of four...

[Bogus]

[It is obvious that the government wants us all to drive small cars. We would all then be on a level playing field as far impact from other cars is concerned………


But what happens when you are hit by a large "white van", let alone a 38 ton truck.[/QUOTE]

They actually want as many of us as possible out of our cars and on bikes or buses and trains. Its not only this stirring up of 4x4 hatreds and tax increases and fuel increases. I believe they are fooling with road systems, one way streets everywhere, tank traps in every street, illogical traffic signal timings, and all kinds of strange traffic management schemes. I think that they are actively trying to create congestion so that it will become more attractive to use public transport. I know we have remote area country dwellers to consider but I suppose they just become casualties of this plan and have to cough up whatever duties are imposed.
You might think Im paranoid and perhaps I am, but that is my suspicion. Anyway a we bit of healthy paranoia is ok isnt it ?

Bogus

[Sancho]

At this rate it would be cheaper to pimp a 2nd or 3rd gen than buy a new 4X4

That's the plan

As for Bogus's point, I think that's the exactly the idea. I don't think it's actually that bad an idea, but I live in London. I can only just remember growing up in the countryside and having to wait two hours for a bus.

If they actually make public transport better, create more cycle lanes etc etc, I'm all for it (within reason). To be fair to Red Ken, public transport and cycle routes in London are now much, much better than they were five years ago, mostly thanks to charging every prick who wants to drive through the middle of London during the day a fiver.

[AndyLala]

Jeez, I though it was a democracy...

Don't start on Red Ken... just heard that in the governments infinite wisdom, instead of concentrating on education (as they promised 10 years ago...) vehicle fuel and airpot tax is going up again...

So how does that help education, or even help this environemntal/fashion bias.

All that seems to do, in my humble naive view is stop more stuff getting delivered, by pushing its price up (again)...

[Sancho]

Jeez, I though it was a democracy...

Don't start on Red Ken... just heard that in the governments infinite wisdom, instead of concentrating on education (as they promised 10 years ago...) vehicle fuel and airpot tax is going up again...

So how does that help education, or even help this environemntal/fashion bias.

All that seems to do, in my humble naive view is stop more stuff getting delivered, by pushing its price up (again)...

It is a democracy, but it's also a capitalist economy. If you want choice you gotta pay for it. It sucks, but it beats the sh1t out of spending all morning queuing for bread.

I can bang on about how prices have actually decreased in real terms over the last few years again if you like ......

Anyway, I was just saying that every now and then some of this hot air does turn into something real. There are more buses in London and they are safer and cleaner. There are also more cycle lanes.

I don't know about the education thing. Unfortunately, it seems the average teenager is such a scumbag that they don't want to learn anything anyway. They'd be better off ditching a formal curriculum and teaching the b@stards something they might be interested in and which might actually be useful. I learnt NOTHING useful in secondary school; I could do all the maths I need today and could read and write by the time I left primary school. I wish they'd taught me electrics, carpentry, plumbing etc etc (and a little bit of discipline) at secondary school. I still, to this day, do not give a fcuk who assassinated who to start the first world war.

[PDR]

I heard on the radio this morning that the tax on fuel is going up to help pay for education……

Well I don’t have any children so this is no benefit to me… so I want a refund!

Why should I pay for someone elses kids?

[Chillitt]

I heard on the radio this morning that the tax on fuel is going up to help pay for education……

Well I don’t have any children so this is no benefit to me… so I want a refund!

Why should I pay for someone elses kids?

because they will grow up to be policemen or doctors or whatever and they will look after you in your dotage. (or more likely, steal your truck, smash your windows and cause you to pay even more tax to pay their dole...)

[NFC]

About time!

Once the fashion-conscious [deleted] have moved on to other vehicles, the image of a 4x4 being driven by a [deleted] will disappear.

The government will see no mileage taxing 4x4s excessively becasue there won't be enough coming out of the showrooms to make it worthwhile, and the accident statistics will stop being skewed by people who spend their time in the car thinking "how good do I look" instead of concentrating on driving.

And I might be able to pick-up a cheap 3rd or even 4th Gen when it comes time to replace venerable 2nd Gen.

And people won't mistake me for some fashion-conscious [deleted] who bought a 4x4 to pose.

[laser_jock@work]

It's actually really good news for 4x4 drivers if you think about it!

Lets face it- the first owner of a brand new 4x4 (the 'Chelsea Tractor' bunch shall we surmise) will never take the car offroad.

The second owner (a wanna be 'Chelsea Tractor' type or possibly a 'mum to school' type) will never take the car offroad.

It's the THIRD OWNWER and subsequent owners who might actually get the vehicle muddy.

THIRD OWNER THEORY- you read here first!

So what if used values plunge- who cares?

First owner 'Mr Chelsea Tractor' has too much money to care anyway. Second owner 'Mum to school' will be driving an even less environmentaly friendly people carrier and 'Mr Offroader' gets a bargain luxury 4x4 for peanuts.

Everyone's a winner!

Do I care if my 13 year car has lost value.....no. Doubt if I could give it away in it's current state!