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**andycook** · 1 September 2006, 11:25

out of interest why the front diff ?
as far as I am aware, most people fit diff-lock to rear axle first ?

I would love to fit diff-lock to rear axle of my truck - the limited slip one no longer does it job - clutch plates nagered,
but cost of getting the parts, and I dont have the skill to set up the new diff - so big labour bill to get it fitted - put me off.....

there is good discussion of difflocks on the Ozzie surf site
http://www.toyotasurf.asn.au/

if you dig around the forum etc - and a guide to fitting a front diff locker

**Slugsie** · 1 September 2006, 11:30

Two reasons why I'm looking at a front diff locker...

1. In normal use (i.e. 2wd) it will be disengaged (especially with manual hubs), and so will have no effect on the handling.
2. I read a review somewhere (can't for the life of me remember where though) where they discussed the merits of fitting front vs rear lockers, and in their tests it showed that fitting a front locker had the most beneficial effect on off-road traction.

**Gamedawn** · 1 September 2006, 11:32

I think you're right to say that the rear diff should be done first. The front diff and drive train can be a bit fragile with a locker fitted and you'll get more advantage from the rear unit. Manual hubs are a definite plus with or without a locker and the original fitment Aisins are the ones to go for. The only thing to be aware of is that hubs from a solid axle pickup won't fit - they have to be from an independent suspension truck.

**andycook** · 1 September 2006, 11:45

you can get WARN hubs here:
http://www.arbil4x4.co.uk/category.php?category=160

i have these, imported from USA,

not sure how they compare with Aisin ones
but bet the WARN ones are better than the milners ones - think milners are AVM? but might be wrong

**Slugsie** · 1 September 2006, 11:59

Originally posted by andycook

you can get WARN hubs here:
http://www.arbil4x4.co.uk/category.php?category=160

i have these, imported from USA,

not sure how they compare with Aisin ones
but bet the WARN ones are better than the milners ones - think milners are AVM? but might be wrong

Thanks Andy. I presume I go for these ones:

Toyota Pickup, Hi-Lux, 4-Runner, with ADD 86-95 26 28761 �125.50

**andycook** · 1 September 2006, 12:22

I would double check those are correct ones, but part no sounds right.

there was discussion on here last year about merits of different brands of FWH so best to do a search,

e.g. http://www.hiluxsurf.co.uk/forums/sh...light=AVM+hubs
http://www.hiluxsurf.co.uk/forums/sh...light=AVM+hubs

I have been following this thread:

http://www.toyotasurf.asn.au/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9835

on locker installing, and look forward to the guy posting his rear rocker write up in the tech section, the front locker write-up is already there.

Seems you can get these POWERTRAX lockers quite cheap in USA http://stores.ebay.com/Rocky-Road-Ou...QQftidZ2QQtZkm

there would be delivery, VAT and duty to add to the prices, but still think with current exchange rate, they will be cheaper than buying a detroit locker from likes of roughtrax or milners - where they are around 350+VAT each

seems to me you could get them from USA for 250 quid. you could also probably get a detroit locker from USA.
wonder how much they weigh!, im off to US later this month...

also, not sure how complicated it is to fit the rear lockers, thought it would need skilled measurement of backlash etc and other things i dont understand, with a dial gauge

I wouldnt mind a rear limited slip locker to help with driving in snow, in those situations when im on a snowy or slushy road and not sure whether or not to use 4wd

**Slugsie** · 1 September 2006, 12:32

Very useful information Andy, thanks.

I haven't decided which locker to get, or from where, but I think you're right in that it may be best to buy it from the USA. I'm fairly sure there are a couple places (and probably ebay sellers) who'd ship over here.

As for fitting, I'm pretty much resigned to having to pay a mechanic to do it, I don't have the tools or knowledge on how to do this, so it'll have to be passed on to someone else.

My 2.4 has a LSD rear axle, and I'm sure it's been a tremendous help when I've been playing in the silly stuff. Unfortunately my 3ltr doesn't. Wonder if they can be swapped?

(pretty sure the answer is no)

**Gamedawn** · 1 September 2006, 14:00

Originally posted by Slugsie

My 2.4 has a LSD rear axle, and I'm sure it's been a tremendous help when I've been playing in the silly stuff. Unfortunately my 3ltr doesn't. Wonder if they can be swapped?

(pretty sure the answer is no)

The answer is yes if the ratios are the same - compare the axle codes on the vin plates.

**andycook** · 1 September 2006, 14:35

thats if the LSD clutch plates still working - they dont on my 158,000 mile 4runner.
if i jackup one of back wheels, i cannot drive it, the jacked up wheel spins. if working the LSD clutch should transmit power to wheel on ground.
however, if on gravel or mud or snow, I have occasionally spun both wheels at same moment, so the clutch plates must grip occasionally. but this is no use if one wheel has grip and other is in mud, as it will just spin wheel in the mud....

axle code and sticker on diff housing showed the diff is LSD,
and if both wheels off ground, and i turn one by hand, other rotates the same direction (on an open diff they would rotate opposite directions)

**TonyN** · 1 September 2006, 17:22

Cheap hubs won't like large tyres and locked diffs, but even the cheap ones Milners sell are usually OK for most uses.

Personally I'd put a rear locker in first, the trouble with front lockers on a Surf is the outer CV joints don't like lots of load, especially on full lock. You can granade a outer CV with a open diff, full lock and a bit of throttle, let alone with the poor CV getting 100% of the engine power from a locker.

As Roger said, any Toyota 8" diff will fit the rear, but the ratio need to be the same as the front diff. Avoid early 2.4's that have a 2 pinion diff (code 2) as the 4 pinion diffs (code 4 or LSD code 5) are much stronger.

Lockers are lots of fun, but manual ones like the ARB are better as you can turn them off, the cheaper lockers are usually auto lockers with work all the time, despite what most people might think, a locked axle isn't always a good thing, especially in ice and snow when cornering.

**Gamedawn** · 1 September 2006, 17:38

Originally posted by TonyN

despite what most people might thing, a locked axle isn't always a good thing, especially in ice and snow when cornering.

Or on a side slope

**TonyN** · 1 September 2006, 17:40

Originally posted by Gamedawn

Or on a side slope

yup!

**The Lovely Boyo** · 1 September 2006, 18:02

Originally posted by Slugsie

I haven't decided which locker to get, or from where, but I think you're right in that it may be best to buy it from the USA.

I also would agree.

Love 'em or hate 'em, the Yanks really know their off roading and the 4runner is a popular model for modifying.

I just had a quick search of the tinterweb and there's loads of sites offering some really serious gear.

start with this nut case http://www.4crawler.com/4Runner.shtml#top

Off ya go...............

**Gizmo** · 1 September 2006, 22:47

Originally posted by andycook

thats if the LSD clutch plates still working - they dont on my 158,000 mile 4runner.
if i jackup one of back wheels, i cannot drive it, the jacked up wheel spins. if working the LSD clutch should transmit power to wheel on ground.
however, if on gravel or mud or snow, I have occasionally spun both wheels at same moment, so the clutch plates must grip occasionally. but this is no use if one wheel has grip and other is in mud, as it will just spin wheel in the mud....

axle code and sticker on diff housing showed the diff is LSD,
and if both wheels off ground, and i turn one by hand, other rotates the same direction (on an open diff they would rotate opposite directions)

Change yours to a detroit truelocker?....LSD doesnt use clutch plates!

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