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  • EGR fault (TECHNICAL)

    Hi there, Ive recently purchased a toyota surf jap import 2.4td on a 1994. The vehicle runs fine on idle but when accelerating either on idle or when driving it kicks out a massive amout of black smoke. The vehicle feels alot quicker than i would expect and i think this is related to the fault. Other than the excesive amount of black smoke the engine sounds fine no knocking or anything. I suspect this is an EGR fault and procided as folowed- cheked vaccume at egr valve and there is no/very little vaccume there, ive checked all the vaccume pipes and there is no leaks i can find, then i checked the vaccume to the main vaccume pipe from the alternator and that is fine good vaccume.
    ive done alittle research and ive herd alot about bypassing the egr valve but do not want to take this route id just rather get to the bottom of the problem. Anyways the main vaccume pipe runs along the top of the engine and branches off to two pipes one goes to a solenoid for controling a ufo device on the throttle houesing, checked vaccume into the solenoid and thats fine but there is nothing out of the solenoid. This outlet is used to supply the first egr valve solenoid (obviously no vaccume there) and the outlet of the first solenoid is used to supply the second egr valve solenoid then to the egr valve its self. If i vaccume the egr valve so that its partially open the black smoke goes but there is then a diesle knock and excesive white smoke (overfueling). This makes me think that it is definately a egr fault proberbly overfueling when i vac it due to an incorect amount of recerculating gas that is being drawn back into the inlet side? So i was led to belive that solenoids (two that control the vaccume to the egr valve and the one that supplies those (on the ufo looking thing) are not opperating as they should. This is where i need help, Ive checked for voltage to these starting with the solenoid on the ufo thingy. This is getting battery voltage to one terminal but nothing down the other pin (i think this is a switched earth from the engine ecu?). Then checking the first egr solenoid the same battery voltage down one pin and nothing down the other, and finaly the second egr solenid this has both a battery live and an earth. (sorry forgot to mention ive checked these with the engin running and also when reved up). But im stuck i have no info no wiring diagrams dont realy no the princables as to how the egr system opperates, i no what it does but dont no what imputs the ecu has to opperate these solenoids e.g sensors, engine speed from pump? e.t.c so basically i would realy realy apriciate any help on this idealy egr wiring diagrams? what imputs to te ecu this req for egr opperation, what the ufo thingy is? why is there 2 solenoids that control the egr? and under what engine opperation should the egr valve open and how much?
    Hope i havent confused you all too much and can i thank you for reading my thread.
    Martin

  • #2
    Hello, good evening and welcome ( or was that someone else?)

    To be honest I didn't read your whole post, as I got bored after about 2" 0f text.

    My advice, along with most others will be to disconect the ERG, as it was fitted to comply with Japanese immission laws, which do not apply here.

    I have done this mod, as have lots of others, and it causes no problems, and reduces the black smoke to a minimum.
    Rob

    Still working for the man!

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Martin , got to agree with Bob , just pull off the little rubber pipe from
      the valve and tierap it, job done .
      Done mine some time ago, beter power and mpg, and no black smoke.

      http://www.hiluxsurf.co.uk/forums/at...1&d=1155739046

      Cheers Chris
      Last edited by poppy986; 10 February 2008, 23:30.
      GOT NO COWBOYS HERE?

      Comment


      • #4
        isnt this in effect the same as having no vaccume to the valve?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by melvin brag View Post
          isnt this in effect the same as having no vaccume to the valve?
          Nope. It's exactly the same as having no vacuum to the valve.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by MattF View Post
            Nope. It's exactly the same as having no vacuum to the valve.
            Unless the pipe is on a conveyor that is.

            I'll get me coat.
            Paul </Slugsie>
            Immortal.so far!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Slugsie View Post
              Unless the pipe is on a conveyor that is.

              I'll get me coat.
              I should think so too.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by MattF View Post
                I should think so too.
                Originally posted by melvin brag View Post
                Hi there, Ive recently purchased a toyota surf jap import 2.4td on a 1994. The vehicle runs fine on idle but when accelerating either on idle or when driving it kicks out a massive amout of black smoke. The vehicle feels alot quicker than i would expect and i think this is related to the fault. Other than the excesive amount of black smoke the engine sounds fine no knocking or anything. I suspect this is an EGR fault and procided as folowed- cheked vaccume at egr valve and there is no/very little vaccume there, ive checked all the vaccume pipes and there is no leaks i can find, then i checked the vaccume to the main vaccume pipe from the alternator and that is fine good vaccume.
                ive done alittle research and ive herd alot about bypassing the egr valve but do not want to take this route id just rather get to the bottom of the problem. Anyways the main vaccume pipe runs along the top of the engine and branches off to two pipes one goes to a solenoid for controling a ufo device on the throttle houesing, checked vaccume into the solenoid and thats fine but there is nothing out of the solenoid. This outlet is used to supply the first egr valve solenoid (obviously no vaccume there) and the outlet of the first solenoid is used to supply the second egr valve solenoid then to the egr valve its self. If i vaccume the egr valve so that its partially open the black smoke goes but there is then a diesle knock and excesive white smoke (overfueling). This makes me think that it is definately a egr fault proberbly overfueling when i vac it due to an incorect amount of recerculating gas that is being drawn back into the inlet side? So i was led to belive that solenoids (two that control the vaccume to the egr valve and the one that supplies those (on the ufo looking thing) are not opperating as they should. This is where i need help, Ive checked for voltage to these starting with the solenoid on the ufo thingy. This is getting battery voltage to one terminal but nothing down the other pin (i think this is a switched earth from the engine ecu?). Then checking the first egr solenoid the same battery voltage down one pin and nothing down the other, and finaly the second egr solenid this has both a battery live and an earth. (sorry forgot to mention ive checked these with the engin running and also when reved up). But im stuck i have no info no wiring diagrams dont realy no the princables as to how the egr system opperates, i no what it does but dont no what imputs the ecu has to opperate these solenoids e.g sensors, engine speed from pump? e.t.c so basically i would realy realy apriciate any help on this idealy egr wiring diagrams? what imputs to te ecu this req for egr opperation, what the ufo thingy is? why is there 2 solenoids that control the egr? and under what engine opperation should the egr valve open and how much?
                Hope i havent confused you all too much and can i thank you for reading my thread.
                Martin
                I have similar problem,but I have a Surf with no grunt or power really.HELP

                Comment


                • #9
                  im lost here, so nipping the vaccume to the egr valve is the same as the fault ive got.?!? how could this cure the black smoke. mines chucking out loads of black smoke because the egr valve is in the closed position, blocking the egr will be doing exactly the same so how will i cure my fault.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi, the black smoke you are getting can be caused by many things, the erg valve is just one of them, and is the place to start before you start to spend money you don't need to.

                    Black smoke is caused by the erg valve opening, and recirculating the eexhaust gasses back into the the engine to be burnt with new fuel and air.

                    Because the clean air is now mixed with exhaust gas, the fuel/air ratio becomes fuel rich, and therefore you get black smoke ( in varying quantities depending on how well or not the erg is working, and the condition of your fuel pump, air filter etc,etc.)

                    So the place to start is to crimp the vacuum hose that operates the erg valve, and see if that helps with the black smoke, if it does, then you can fit blanking plates for a more permanent fix ( or not)

                    If this easy mod doesn't work, then you can look at the fuel/air system, for more complicated and expensive fixes.
                    Rob

                    Still working for the man!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      cheers for the help so far much appriciated, if i crimp the pipe to the valve off its still exactly the same, thats what led me to check for a vaccume at the valve. so when i found there was no vac thats when i wanted to check further. (solenoids e.t.c any suggestions?)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by poppy986 View Post
                        Hi Martin , got to agree with Bob , just pull off the little rubber pipe from
                        the valve and tierap it, job done .
                        Done mine some time ago, beter power and mpg, and no black smoke.

                        http://www.hiluxsurf.co.uk/forums/at...1&d=1155739046

                        Cheers Chris
                        how important is it to bend the rubber pipe and cable tie it. Is it for neatness or does blocking the pipe have some purpose
                        thanks
                        nigel
                        Surf K Reg LN130 2.4 AUTO

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by melvin brag View Post
                          Hi there
                          Didn't quote the rest because it would take forever to answer all those questions, fully explain how the EGR works on these and try to figure out the basically unknown as to what controls the VSVs. It's probably a combination of Throttle Position Sensor and other sensors but nobody knows for sure.

                          Just disable the EGR Valve and consider blanking plates if there's an chance the valve is sticking open.

                          Nev

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by nigel129 View Post
                            how important is it to bend the rubber pipe and cable tie it. Is it for neatness or does blocking the pipe have some purpose
                            thanks
                            nigel
                            Bend and cable tie or block the hose with a ball bearing or something similar and reconnect. It's all the same thing just different ways to do it.

                            Nev

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by NiftyNev View Post
                              Didn't quote the rest because it would take forever to answer all those questions, fully explain how the EGR works on these and try to figure out the basically unknown as to what controls the VSVs. It's probably a combination of Throttle Position Sensor and other sensors but nobody knows for sure.

                              Just disable the EGR Valve and consider blanking plates if there's an chance the valve is sticking open.

                              Nev
                              is there a way of telling if the valve is open, ive got no black smoke at all, but i am trying to get the brick to run a bit more ecconomically.
                              thanks
                              Surf K Reg LN130 2.4 AUTO

                              Comment

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