Increase in temp on hills, no coolant loss - advise please

[sathelp]

Hi
I have had my 2.4 MkII (K) surf a year now and been very satisified especially as I use it for a 140 mile round trip 4 days a week.

Any way ever since I have had it, I have always had this increase in temp on any hills and would like some advise please on the way ahead to tackle this problem.

The engine heats up very quick and the needle sits just below the middle all the time even on hot days or slogging it (as much as you can). I use no water and do keep an eye on the expansion tank in case. However If I go up any hills,up goes the temp to nearly to hot mark! I know its going to go up a bit but as many people here say that theirs doe not move at all, it does concern me. A couple of examples for those who know the roads is the A31 hill at junction 1 M27 west bound or the hill on Portland in Dorset. The worst it ever gets is on Telegraph hill on the A279(?) / A38 junction.

Obviously I am worried about damage to the head. I am unsure if it has been replaced or not. So do you think that the rad is blocked or therm buggered, or is this a case of a pro flush.

For info, I can hear the electric fan come on when it gets hot (If I am standing still restarting the engine) so I know that is working as is the aircon.

So Guys and Gals can you give me your experiences if you have had this problem with your resolutions and costs so I can start to get some sort of plan together before my holidays to the hilly west country fully loaded with my top box.

Many thanks and look forward to your sugestions and help.

[MattF]

Various probabilities. Start by flushing and refilling the coolant system, replacing rad cap and thermostat whilst you're at it. Also, check that the viscous fan is operating correctly.

[Tallyman]

Added to Matt's comments, if it's an automatic then the ATF fluid could be overheating on hills and adding to the heat in the bottom of the rad, thereby keeping the coolant hot when it's going back into the engine.

If it is that, fit an additional ATF oil cooler in front of the rad.

If you do go down the flush & replace coolant road, make sure you get all the air out of the system. And don't worry too much about Telegraph Hill. That's one hell of a long haul and it bound to get the engine hot, especially as you will slow down going up and reduce the airflow through the rad. Also look at some of the other cooling mods, like bonnet fans, air vents or raising the back edge of the bonnet to aid cooling by allowing the hot air under the bonnet to escape easier.

[sathelp]

Thanks for the replies. I believe that the ATF is fine as again it never looses any or lokks / smells dead.
I think that I wil go for the flush, therm and cap route first. I really feel that extra cooling should not be used if other Sirfs run fine without, it really points to a issue (rather than a problem) of the engine.
I will report back after its done, hopefully get it in next week for its MOT, so I will try to have it at the same time.
Thanks.

[graham78]

i got a 2.4 2nd gen and recently it got hot on hills, i would reccomend pressure washing your rad, if you off road or go near to dusty roads the rad can bet blocked easily and there isnt much space...

the cooler mod is the best bet as mine is okay till i get to 70 mph up hill then it gets warm!!!

[Antshiel]

Fit a bypass switch on the rad an before the temp sensor, i did it on mine for pulling a boat. Flick it on at the first sight of a hill and it'll keep temperature down. I also bought a TM2 engine temperature monitor (pic) which is useful for keeping an eye on engine temp as dash guages are cr@p and only warn you when the damage is actually done.

[sathelp]

Well its back from the garage for its MOT and it sails through all bar an advisory on one tyre and a rear bush.

However the not so good news.
The coolant flush went well and cleared a fair bit out but it needed about 3 litres of water to fill it up, bad sign. Once flushed and filled the pressure built up quick showing the tell tail signs of head damage. I never noticed it as it was quite low on water.

The man who knows stopped all work then and gave me a call. He thinks that there is a small hairline crack and it is blowing out as water moisture through the exhaust as he says there was no oil in the water. The rad cap, fan and thermostat all tested fine so were not replaced.

So as I really thought but needed to test the rest first, its head swap time and off to Stevo for a new head as I am not letting my baby go. Shame he was not in to take my call earlier today, so I will ring in the morning to get one sent down. I am one person who is not going the ebay or repair route, I would not trust it.
If Stevo is watching this thread please message me and we can get things moving, if not I will cal tomorrow.

I will report back again once all done. Its lasted 14 years on the original head, so lets hope it will last another 14 plus on another new one.

[MattF]

Bad luck on the head. At least you know she'll be rock solid with the new one on.

[sathelp]

Thanks.
I got hold of Stevo today and new head on its way. Hopefully get it swapped over next Friday or the following Monday garage space permitting.
I will let you know how it goes.......

[sathelp]

Well the head arrived Tuesday and was fitted yesterday. However when it was all put back and started a small oil leak was noticed around the oil lube tube between the engine and turbo. Unfortunatly the small metal once only gasket (about £1.09's worth) was not a part of Stevo's head and parts that were sent down and it can not be used a second time.
As it's Bank Holiday weekend it is not going to be fitted now until Tuesday and that is as long as one arrives in Dorchester Toyota in the morning. I am going to pick it up and post it through my garage mans letter box so he can take the manafold etc back off and fit it. Hopefull get my truck back on Tuesday then.
The good news was that when they did start it, there is no more sign of any back preasure so it has been sorted. I will be putting a manual electric fan switch on or under my dash to give me a little more control.
So to those who use Stevo's great offer and delivery, just double check you have all the extra bits first like this small gasket. You could bodg it with some silocon I suppose but if its worth doing then its worth doing right.

I let you know how it goes when it comes back on Tuesday.

[sathelp]

Well its back with me now. Been a while because I work strange hours it has been difficult to pick it up.
Any way, head done. rebuilt and running fine. Total 10 hours labour, so not cheap but if you think that it now has a new cam belt, then that cost can come off the bill really so its not too bad. So back on the streets of Hampshire, Dorset and Devon. You can't miss me I must be the only Red surf with a hugh grey top box on top !!!!!, so give me a toot if you see me.

I still have tow niggly questions if anyone else had this after a change or if its soemthing that they have come accross. The first is that since its change it does not start as simply as it did. It always started first turn (after preheat) but now not always so [Edit, my inpatients I think. If I wait for the correct ping sound it is fine] and the second if that sometimes get a bit of vibration through the gas pedal. Not all the time but I am sure it was not there before [Edit, still there a little but found a pipe not sitting correctly in its mount over the top of the engine, could have been this].I may be picking at nothing but as you all know, you know your surf and any changes that happen but you aleways listen and feel things after it coems out of the garage. I will speak to the man tomorow when I pay the bill so any thoughts before then would be really good.

Electric fan overide switch to do now, cables ready switch in place, just got to feed the wires through the bulkhead now and connect. Also still got to sort out the oil guage sensor cable / gauge / sensor. Then I think its all top line. [Edit, completed the fan overide switch after breaking the switch (disintegrated when touched!) and replacing it from Toyota and then found the spade connector looking loose wire and popped it back on to the oil guage sensor, all sorted now.]

Thanks for your help and advise and to Stevo for my head. And finally, remember do not get it done on a bank holiday weekend without the Turbo oil seal gasket like me, it really held it up. You learn.......