Head gasket advice needed

[Pika1971]

I have a 1990 2.4 surf. Yesterday while on the motorway I noticed the temperature gauge going up very rapidly, it hit the red in about 5 seconds so I turned on the heater as I couldn't pull over straight away because of traffic and had to wait about 10 seconds for the warm air to come out and as fast as the temp gauge had gone up it went down, because I only had about 20 miles to go I just kept the heater on full and one eye on the temp gauge, then I noticed that the warm air turn cold, that worried me and the temp was going up it hit the red so I pulled over immediately and called the AA. When they turned up it was dark and all they could try was putting water in, it took about 1.5 pints, and I was asked sarcastically "so do you check the water then?" I replyed by saying I check the expansion bottle and that has never got below the low line. Anyway drove the last 20 miles and the temp stayed ok and the heater stayed hot. This morning checked the water level by taking the rad cap off and it had gone down again, it took another pint to fill it up, then I started it up looking for obvious leaks underneath and nothing, but I did notice that it looked like something very small bubbling on the head, although there was a bit on oil there the bubbling looked very localised and looked more like water bubbling, so I called them back on the basis that if the head gasket has gone then I didn't want to drive 70 miles home and potentially wreck the head. Another AA guy turned up and did various tests, he added more water but thought the bubbling on the head was excess water he had spilt, so he tested the rad cap and it was totally shot, it would't take any pressure, also you could see on the bonnet where water had sprayed out above the cap, he said that if the coolant pressure was down then the water would boil at a lower temp and may have damaged the head gasket. He did various pressure tests through the cooling system and it didn't really show anything, he said the coolant pressure was ok and that if the head had gone it would should show up instantly when he reved the engine but it didn't seem to bad but wasn't perfect, also he did some test for gas with green liquid in a tube and that seemed ok, but there is a small amount of oil on the head. His diagonosis was that the rad cap was buggered and so was the head gasket, but not badly damaged, so we stuck it on a truck to bring it home. A couple of things worry me, firstly I have seen so may posts on this forum about heads going on 2.4's and mine did get into the red on the temp gauge if only for a few seconds, the consensus seems to be that if it goes into the red the head cracks, also if the head has gone as a result of the rad cap being knackered surely my garage should have checked the rad cap some time during the last 2 services, they may not have the gismos and gadgets the AA has to test the cap, but even to the eye you can see the seals are worn. Any advice would be useful, problem is my local garage is a landrover specialist and I have never been that impressed with their work, and they are the only local 4x4 place and the problem may have been caused by them not checking the ****** rad cap in the first place. On top of the pressure tests on the cooling system the AA guy did, is there anything else I can do to determine if its the head or just the gasket? also how much does changing a head or gasket cost????
PS Sorry for the long post, but its been a long weekend, lol.....

[poppy986]

Sorry to hear that me old m8.
Check the ovious first rad cap, termostat, leaks/ bunged up
radiator ect.
Has it been preasure tested,thats the only sure way if its
knackered then it wont be the gasket it would be the head
been there done that, then off to Stevo to get sorted.
Keep us up dated.
Chris

[Pika1971]

Tests

Cheers Poppy,

The AA did 3 tests,
1) He attached a pressure gauge to the rad and said that if the head had gone it should show, but it didn't really show anything but a very small amount of pressure loss.
2) He put a gas testing thing into the rad too, he said that if the head had gone the water in his gadget should change colour, but it didn't.
3) He tested the pressure of the rad cap with some gadget, it wouldn't take any pressure.
So I know the rad cap has gone, and that would account for a small water loss, plus you can see that water has sprayed onto the bonnet. And as the pressure loss was so small and there is oil on the head, he assumed a gasket gone.

Also there is a small amount of white smoke when its cold and you rev it hard.

I am hoping that the garage I have taken it to will be able to determine for definate, I just got really concerned when I saw the small area bubbling on the head.
Do you know how much does it cost to change the head? and do you have a number for Stevo? if I am going to get it done I would like to get it done properly..Thanks again dude....

[Guest]

Most 2LT engines weap a bit of oil from the head gasket at the front on the passenger side so it isn't much to worry about. If the preesure test and the Gas test (green dye stuff) didn't show anything amiss then you are probably OK with the head.

Change the rad cap and monitor for a few days and see if the water stays at the same level.

However the white smoke is not always a good sign, often caused by head gasket or head gone - White smoke is steam basically caused by water in the combustion chamber. Can be water in the diesel though.

[Pika1971]

Rad cap success

Well guys, got a new rad cap and put it on and bingo, seems fine, water level not dropping and no over heating..
And the term weaping is about right, and yes its on the passenger side..

[poppy986]

Now thats a result. Now think of the goodies that you can go
and buy with the money that you would have spent if the head
had gone, go on you know it makes sence

Good luck m8ty Chris.

[mud skipper]

question 4 u
any ideas when i tow my caravan all is ok until i get to a hill the temp rises all the way into the red if i pull over and rev the engine it drops to normal in about 2 mins then carry on , if i put all heaters on full it rises to the edge of the red then drops, just bought a new caravan tonight and got the gauge into the red 4 time and once thru the red and all is still ok apart from my pants. this weekend im going for a new cap and im going to lock up the viscous fan if this fails then an oil cooler is next if that all fails then the fcker is up for sale
shame as its brill otherwise even hammering it off road it fails to move the gauge , but shove a van on its tail and show it a hill it sh1ts itself and so do i.
i dont understand why the temp drops so quickly when the load is taken off, if the engine was getting as hot as the gauge suggests surley it would take ages to drop in temp and damage would be inevitable. help if i'm going about it wrong
john

[Chillitt]

john, have you changed the trans fluid yet? that and a cooler and mine seems cured...

[BUSHWHACKER]

And get yer fan locked, works for me.

[Pika1971]

Sudden rise and fall

Yeah mine did that too, very strange, like you say it can't be actuate, how can an engine go from normal to red and back again in 30 seconds... but mine was just low water in the cooling system and a knackered rad cap, filled up and put new cap on..and bingo, been doing loadsa miles and water hasn't dropped and inch..