Extended front shocks

[Paul1566]

Well i haven't been on here for a while but now wish i had.... needed new shocks for my surf to pass MOT, its had extensions on the rear shocks since a brought it and so i thought buy 2" extended rears, well that's all sorted now but with out thinking it through i assumed that because the front was wound up i would be better off with plus 2" fronts...... i can hear you laugh from here.... well they fit but bottomed out when dropping off large kerb, thought that can't be right and so got on here and searched the forum..... you still laughing....... today i read that Greg212 did the same thing beginning of July, now i feel his pain, and who's gunna want to buy extended shocks, no one as i can now see.........unless they are standard fit to something else like a dodge camper van or whatever.... of course if i had not fitted them and they were still in the box i could return them and exchange for standard, but hey ho they are on for now......... another £80 going on me card then.....

[yoshie]

If you have wound the torsion bars then +2 shocks will be fine the extra travel will be fine.
The bump stops should do exactly that, the damper should not be able to close completely.

What dampers did you fit?

I have fitted +2 and +3 to surfs and never had problems

[Paul1566]

Monroe shocks from roughtrax..... suppose i could paint the bump stop, drop off the same kerb and see if the paint marks the arm, if it don't its the shocks not the stops.....

[Paul1566]

Update.....Marked shock at rest then took shock off and marked fully compressed length, then measured difference, when sat at rest distance between bump stop and lower a-arm is approx 1/16" less than full compression..... if you get what i mean..... so shock will bottom out if bump stop compresses more than 1/16" which i imagine it will....... so will be buying standard shocks......

[yoshie]

Or alter the bump stop.
Standard length dampers will top out on extension due to the increase height of the wound torsion bars.

Might not if you still have arb fitted, but what's the point of the lift in that case?

[andyverran]

Or alter the bump stop.
Standard length dampers will top out on extension due to the increase height of the wound torsion bars.

Might not if you still have arb fitted, but what's the point of the lift in that case?

Your going to have to explain that to me, I don't see why they should top out, total travel is unchanged and the bump stop is the limiting factor, why will they top out?

[yoshie]

Certainly. Because they start at rest extended 2" due to the lift.

[andyverran]

Certainly. Because they start at rest extended 2" due to the lift.

But that doesn't make them droop further or compress further (total travel is the same), surely that just means some of the droop travel has been "pre used" as normal running height, the suspension won't be traveling further it's still limited by the bump stop in upward movement and will be stopped in the downward (I assume by the shock but have not looked).

[yoshie]

Its down I am talking about, he should keep the extended damper or shock as you call it and alter the bumpstop.

[andyverran]

Its down I am talking about, he should keep the extended damper or shock as you call it and alter the bumpstop.

Ok, so in order to get more droop travel new shocks/damper required and those new dampers ;-) will run out of upward travel before the bump stop, that makes sense.

Won't that still mean total travel is unchanged, since droop will be restored but upward then limited sooner by the bump stop?

[Paul1566]

Ok so i think i have seen my error, when you lift a truck by winding the torsion bars up you only move the at rest position of the hub, the geometry of the suspension will not change, the bump stops will not change, the extent the suspension moves will not change, only the fact that you will get more up than down from rest........

Think this little picture explains how my brain worked it out...... numbers are figurative not real dimensions as such......



So in theory you would need to lower the bottom stop to extend the down ward travel, and increase the length of the upper stop to stop the shock bottoming out....

Think that makes sense, well it does in my head......

[Sylux]

I thought winding up the torsion bars, adding 2"+ dampers, and maybe ball-joint spacers were all that was needed for a front suspension lift.

Confused why the 2"+ dampers are giving you issues

[Paul1566]

As andyverran said they run out of upward travel before the bump stop.
By winding the torsion bars up all you do is move the rest point of the suspension, you do not gain any travel.......

Yoshie yes the front arb is still fitted and as you asked "what's the point of the lift in that case" it sits level,
it came with longer rear springs and whacky metal extenders on the rear shocks..... you can just see them here



so the front is wound up to make things sit right......

Have ordered some standard ones now so will soon have pair of plus 2" going cheap.......



.

[andyverran]

I thought winding up the torsion bars, adding 2"+ dampers, and maybe ball-joint spacers were all that was needed for a front suspension lift.

Confused why the 2"+ dampers are giving you issues

Hi Sy,

I was questioning the necessity of the +2" dampers....I think there not needed unless you really need to restore the original 'droop' to the suspension.

Even then, it seems that by adding them and then adjusting the bump stops you get the same travel as you had before you started....sounds like a lot of money for not a lot...I would add though that the extra ground clearance for the diff might be handy if you off road a lot.

[andyverran]

it came with longer rear springs and whacky metal extenders on the rear shocks..... you can just see them here.

That's the same as the mod for the GV, would only be applicable to the rear of a surf (in case anyone wonders)...allows a standard shock to do what Yoshie was talking about...full original droop..same total travel though (just for reference). On the GV though the bump stops where changed by the mod so no issue of the damper/shock bottoming out....

GV mod was these plus the brackets:
http://www.bits4vits.co.uk/store/vit...4-/prod_3.html
Brackets:
http://www.bits4vits.co.uk/store/jim.../prod_883.html
http://www.bits4vits.co.uk/store/vit.../prod_882.html
...and camber bolts:
http://www.bits4vits.co.uk/store/vit...m/prod_22.html

...should anyone have Vitara as well as a Surf.