2000 SSR-X Surf on vegoil?

[DavidB]

Hi all.... my wife is looking at getting a Surf, so as we both can share the benefits of the waste vegoil that I am using in my 1990 Surf - though hers has to be not as rough as mine! We have seen one advertised locally which is a year 2000 3litre SSR-X - question is do the newer versions handle vegoil as well as the older ones? and if not what is the threshold in year of manufacture/model that vegoil doesnt work in?

Many thanks

[Karma Supra]

AFAIK they don;t due to teh injection system.

My 97 takes if fine though, although it works out just as expensive as diesel and way more aggro so I don't bother.

[Voodoo-Child]

AFAIK they don;t due to teh injection system.

My 97 takes if fine though, although it works out just as expensive as diesel and way more aggro so I don't bother.

How come? I get a full tank out of £40....half bio and half new oil.....a full tank at the pump is £70....I'd call it a saving......and its no aggro whatsoever, unless you class pouring a 5 gal drum in using a funnel aggro? I realise the filtration of used stuff can be a bit time consuming/messy....but if you're paying around 60p per litre or, better still, getting it free then wheres the hardship?

[DavidB]

thanks KS.

So is '97 as young as a vegoil consuming Surf can be?

[Sancho]

thanks KS.

So is '97 as young as a vegoil consuming Surf can be?

Don't think so. You need to check the model as some of the later ones have D4D, but I would very much expect a 2000 to be a KZN185 model with exactly the same 1KZT-E engine in at as a '97.

[Karma Supra]

How come? I get a full tank out of £40....half bio and half new oil.....a full tank at the pump is £70....I'd call it a saving......and its no aggro whatsoever, unless you class pouring a 5 gal drum in using a funnel aggro? I realise the filtration of used stuff can be a bit time consuming/messy....but if you're paying around 60p per litre or, better still, getting it free then wheres the hardship?

Yes I call buying drums seperately and pouring them in, then disposing of them more agro then just filling at a pump. If you also factor in the drop in fuel economy it isn't any/much cheaper and not worth the effort. Of course I assume ontop of that you are declaring VAT on the veg oil...

I'm also not sure where you are from, but where I am my truck costs nearer £90 to fill with diesel and Macro charge about £1/l for veg oil...

It does smell nice running on Veg though...

DavidB, I'm not sure when the changeover year is, I thought it was '98 when a few other cosmetic changes came along. Somewhere on the interweb there is a Surf/4runner timeline that shows dates and changes.

[Sancho]

DavidB, I'm not sure when the changeover year is, I thought it was '98 when a few other cosmetic changes came along. Somewhere on the interweb there is a Surf/4runner timeline that shows dates and changes.

KDN185 began in 2000, so it could be either...How exciting, potentially our first D4D 3rd gen.

[Voodoo-Child]

I dont dispose of the barrels, I simply refill them. I must confess, I haven't brimmed the Surfs tank at the pump yet so I was just guessing, but that makes it even more of a saving for me. I also pay £1 a litre at Costco for new oil, which is still 35p a litre cheaper than diesel, thats £7.50 before you stick your VAT on.

You only declare what you use, I might use a litre or 2 more than I have payed VAT on, but only through mismanagement!!

[DavidB]

cheers gents

[charvell]

you dont pay vat on veg oil.

[Rustinho]

you dont pay vat on veg oil.

As far as I'm aware, technically you are supposed to pay VAT on veg oil if you aren't using it as a food substance, although I've never heard of anyone actually declaring it (either here or on the veggie oil forum). The retailer is supposed to deal with it at point of sale when you say to them "I'm using this as fuel for a vehicle". At least I think thats how its supposed to work.

[spacast]

You don't have to pay anything if you use under 2500ltrs of veg/year, or if you make less than 2500 litres of bio diesel/year.

http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsP...yType=document

2.4 What are my obligations?

If you produce 2,500 litres or more biofuels a year, or use 2,500 litres or more of biofuels as motor fuel on which duty has not been paid, you will need to contact us so that we can make arrangements for you to account for the excise duty due on any products set aside, or delivered for use, as a motor fuel.

[Rustinho]

You don't have to pay anything if you use under 2500ltrs of veg/year, or if you make less than 2500 litres of bio diesel.

http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsP...yType=document

Paying excise duty is different to paying VAT on your raw materials.

[spacast]

You don't have to anything if you use less than 2500 litres - you should keep a record in case you are asked for proof, but how the h**l they could prove how much you had used in the last year I do not know

"Date 20 July 2007

Reference xxxxx

Dear Mr xxxxxxxxx

Vegetable Oil/DERV mixture

Thank you for your e-mail dated 15 July 2007 regarding the use of vegetable oil and DERV mixture in your car and whether you have to register with H M Revenue and Customs [HMRC].

The changes brought in under the ‘Biofuels Simplification’ [Revenue and Customs Brief 43/07] whereby producers of biofuels (or other fuel substitutes) who produce (or use) less than 2,500 litres per annum, will no longer be required to make entry, render returns or pay duty, are intended to cover both those who produce or use biofuels (such as biodiesel, or bioethanol), and those who produce or use other ‘fuel substitutes’ (such as vegetable oil).

Anyone producing (or using) more than 2,500 litres per annum will have to make entry of their premises (register), render returns and pay duty.

Where producers or users will exceed 2,500 litres per annum, then they need to make entry of their premises, render returns and pay duty in accordance with Public Notice 179e (which is currently being amended to reflect the recent changes).

For those producers who are ‘registered’ there will remain a continuing requirement for them to show that the fuel that they produce (or use) is Biodiesel (and meets the fiscal definition in HODA) and where this is not the case, they will continue to be liable to the higher rate of duty on the biofuel they produce (or use) at the higher Fuel Substitute rate.

Revenue and Customs Brief 43/07
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/briefs/excise-duty/brief4307.htm

Public Notice 179E
http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsP...ticesAndInfoSh eets&propertyType=document&col umns=1&id=HMCE_CL_000205

I hope the above information is satisfactory, but if you have any further queries regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact the address shown above quoting our reference number.

Yours sincerely



Mr D J Emmerson
Written Enquiries Officer"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...ew-diesel.html

Until now, anyone producing biofuel has been required by law to pay duty of 28.35p on every litre. In addition, it was necessary to submit returns to HM Revenue and Customs every month and hold a permit.

In an attempt to cut red tape, these requirements have been abolished for anyone producing up to 2,500 litres a year.

An HMRC spokesman said: "The real reason was to reduce the administrative burden on us, but it has had a knock-on effect of encouraging people to experiment with their own fuel."

http://www.vegoilmotoring.com/eng/legal-stuff

It used to be the case that to legally use Straight Vegetable Oil as a vehicle fuel you had to pay duty on every litre that you set aside for road fuel purposes. However, since July 2007 if you are using/producing less than 2500 litres per year of SVO which is not duty paid then you are not required to pay duty on this fuel. This essentially means that for a business with low mileage use or for personal motoring, provided that it is not excessive, then the use of SVO can be duty free. Full details of this threshold limit can be found on this link http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/briefs/excise-duty/brief4307.htm.

[Rustinho]

You don't have to anything if you use less than 2500 litres - you should keep a record in case you are asked for proof, but how the h**l they could prove how much you had used in the last year I do not know

Again, the way I read these things is that VAT is different to fuel duty.

VAT is added at point of sale based upon use of product. Foodstuffs are zero rated for VAT, fuels are not.

As far as I can tell, since anyone using SVO for personal use will not be completing VAT returns it basically isn't our problem but if a retailer was suspicious about someone repeatedly buying large amounts of it I suppose they might possibly be held responsible for not adding VAT.

Either way, it's just the way I interpret what I've read about the subject in various places and not something I'm losing any sleep over!

In terms of how much they think you might have used I guess it would depend on how "trustworthy" your records look. I've got a little notebook that I keep in the glovebox with details of all fuel used along with odometer readings (in km), dates, prices, etc. This could be checked back to MOT readings, etc, if they could really be bothered (doubtful).

Better safe than sorry and it only takes me an extra 10 seconds per fill up.