Another Question Legal

[Philip]

Does anyone know if someone uses your test results, your company name and passes of their product as yours, is it criminal theft?
Believe it or not there is someone who i know, who when he sells similar? product to mine, send out all my information, even to the extent that some of it has my name on it. Such as a letter from The Royal Signals White Helmets display team, etc. Ebay have been informed and are going to warn him, for what good that will do as he does the same thing at Car shows.
GOING FOR A CURRY AND A PINT.
Thank you good folks.

Remember the old advert, "your never alone with a strand" thats how i feel about forum members.

[Albannach]

Have you copywritten everything he's using? If so then he's in breach of copyright law. If not, what he's doing is morally wrong, but not illegal.

[MattF]

Does anyone know if someone uses your test results, your company name and passes of their product as yours, is it criminal theft?

I personally would have thought that it would classify as at least fraud and copyright infringement. I suppose you'd need to ask a solicitor to find out the specifics.

[slobodan]

Phillip, I can see your frustration around this problem, I think the best thing would be to pay someone to visit him, and turn his mind around. literally

[Philip]

Slobodan

If you know any Serbs out of work in London let me know!! By the way, my wifes father comes from where you are, Tomic by name. When i was last there in a car, we were driving back to UK and left about 2am. When we were driving through Irig /Srem/ out of nowhere a policeman stands in the middle of the road with arms raised, for us to stop. Wants to see my driving licence and passport. It was like a comedy, the place was deserted. I couldn't find my passport etc and after my wife telling him we were on our way back to England and her Dad was born threre etc, he let us carry on. Ten minutes later i found all the documents in one of my jacket pockets.
At the time it was very surreal, especially in a deserted town about 2-3 AM.
Philip

[slobodan]

If you know any Serbs out of work in London let me know!! By the way, my wifes father comes from where you are, Tomic by name. When i was last there in a car, we were driving back to UK and left about 2am. When we were driving through Irig /Srem/ out of nowhere a policeman stands in the middle of the road with arms raised, for us to stop. Wants to see my driving licence and passport. It was like a comedy, the place was deserted. I couldn't find my passport etc and after my wife telling him we were on our way back to England and her Dad was born threre etc, he let us carry on. Ten minutes later i found all the documents in one of my jacket pockets.
At the time it was very surreal, especially in a deserted town about 2-3 AM.
Philip

Irig is a village, with at least 10 traffic police on duty at all times,
Nice land just north of there in the National Park.
Man, Swap ealing for Irig and leave your troubles behind.


Cafe Skadarlija, W12 7JA, (Shepherds Bush) was always a good place.

[charvell]

i think you will find that it is a deception, theft by percunary advantage, i.e

Section 16 of the 1968 Theft Act

16 Obtaining a Pecuniary Advantage by Deception.

1.

A person who by any deception dishonestly obtains for himself or another any pecuniary advantage shall on conviction on indictment, be liable to a imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years.
2.

The cases in which a pecuniary advantage within the meaning of this section is to be regarded as obtained for a person are cases where...
*

(a) (Repealed) Any debt or charge for which he makes himself liable or is or may become liable (including one not legally enforceable) is reduced in whole or in part, evaded or deferred; or
*

(b) He is allowed to borrow by way of overdraft, or to take out any policy of insurance or annuity contract, or obtains an improvement of the terms on which he is allowed to do so; or
*

(c) He is given the opportunity to earn remuneration or greater remuneration in an office or employment, or to win money by betting.
3.

For purposes of this section 'deception' has the same meaning as in section 15 of this act.

Pecuniary Advantages

So, what is a 'pecuniary advantage'? Without knowing that, the Act cannot be understood.

Essentially, a pecuniary advantage is more money. If you have gained a pecuniary advantage, you are richer than you were before. It also refers to situations where you should have paid for something, but didn't; although you have not gained physical money, your bank balance remains better off than it should be.

So, to understand the specific nature of section 16(2)(a), we need to look at the definition in section 16(1) again:

(1) A person who by any deception dishonestly obtains for himself or another any pecuniary advantage shall on conviction on indictment, be liable to a imprisonment for a term not exceeding five years.

This section has four sub-sections. The first is:

*

By— This means that you must prove a causal nexus, that is, was the crime a direct result of the deception — what was the cause?. Was the deception that which caused the gain? For example, if you lie to get a job, and get paid wages, are the wages for the deception or the job you have done? If it is for the job done, then section 16 does not apply.
*

Deception— Section 16(3) states that deception has the same meaning as in section 15 of the 1968 Theft Act— the section relating to 'obtaining property by deception'. This is section 15:

Section 15(4) 1968 Theft Act—(4) For the purposes of this section 'deception' means any deception (whether deliberate or reckless) by words or conduct as to fact or as to law, including a deception as the present intentions of the person using the deception or any other person.

In other words, although you must intend to steal something, you can recklessly (without directly meaning to, but realising it is a possibility) obtain a pecuniary advantage. Another point is that not only can you deceive through words, it is also possible to deceive by conduct, or by wearing clothes. For example, by dressing up as a pensioner in order to qualify for an OAP discount etc, you are 'deceiving'.
*

Dishonestly— It must be dishonest. If you made a mistake, or did it accidentally, it is unlikely you will be charged.
*

Obtains— This is a specified test that means that you must obtain something, more specific than the test of appropriation used elsewhere in the 1968 Theft Act.

[TobyJug]

wow your having some bad luck these days Philip....

Good luck mate and chin up...

[Philip]

Your right, but at least it gives me something to do, plotting my revenge.
I have the one nutter with THAT web site, who i do not know why he is targeting me and also i have a guy who used to sell my stuff and i would sell his and for 3-4 years it worked out fine. Then without telling me, he starts to sell something resembling my catalyst, but using all my stuff, when he sends his units out to customers.
Of course simplest way is legal way, but all that is expensive. I have, as my wife keeps telling me, been too easy going in the past, but i suppose t5he recession changes things.
Anyway you lot are great,
Thanks Philip

[blackpoolsparks]

Phillip
Plotting you revenge, as you say, as well as designing web sites to combat adversaries is doing only one thing. Wasting your time and diverting your attention from the reason you set up in business in the first place: making money.
You will never get rid of all the hassle, as soon as you clear these 2 up (maybe) another will pop up.
Leave it, and focus on growing your business.

I dont know what fuel-cat is and didnt know you sold it.
So I was a potential customer
Rather than focusing on selling me your product, you directed me to a site where you are fighting with someone else. Is this an effective way of utilising your time?
Start selling, stop diverting your attention to idiots.