Negative Opinions and How Strong is The Roof?

[Nick V]

Having spoken to a number of well known 4x4 parts suppliers, I am surprised how negative their responses are towards the Surf I am also surprised how few actually carry many parts for the Surf compared to other 4x4's that are out there.

I would like to fit some kind of rack/roof rails, and I know lots have done this, but one of the first things is that I was told was that one of the reasons that they don't do much for the Surf when preparing a vehicle for expedition type stuff etc, is that the roof is not strong enough to carry anything!. I know there is no guttering on the Surf, and roof rails /racks can be fitted, but surely the roof isn't that weak - is it? So, how strong is the roof?

Another thing I was told is that the the suspension set up is a major limiting factor, and that you cannot do that much with it! I would also be better off with a vehicle with a solid front axle! I was a bit surprised at this one because having been on this forum, as well as sites in the U.S. and down under, these trucks get put through some real rough stuff - over rocks, through the mucky stuff - with no problems, some even with the standard suspension set up! To me, unless I was to go extreme off road, I would not even consider converting to a solid axle.

I know that many of you give your trucks real use and abuse, and apart from the odd breakage, you have no problems. You also have Bundebashers truck for example, that has been thousands of hard miles overland, fully laden, and again no real problems.

I know we all use a couple of specialist suppliers in Milners and Roughtrax, but why are we only really limited to these, and why do a number of the other suppliers have such a negative opinion of the Surf - or then again am I paranoid?

Cheers, Nick

[Apache]

I'm sure part of the reason is they make so much more money selling parts for LRs.

However, there ARE better offroaders (as standard) than the Surf out there, and solid front axle will help - BUT at the expense of normal day to day comfort.

As far as expedition vehicles - you only need to look around and see how many Hilux / Surf / LC derived vehicles are out in the boonies of Australia, Africa and the Arctic to know that he's talking through his a-hole on that point.

The roof isn't as strong as some, but that doesn't mean it cant be done.

[biosurf]

Ive been thinking on this too as I would love some kind of roof rack that is at least standable on. I wonder whether theres any value in creating a kind of cube shaped roll cage affair to just enclose the cabin space, . so essentially a box that would incorprate rock sliders but would allow for cross braces to run across the roof to strengthen the cage and to use as a roof rack.

Not sure of the physics involved so I'm not sure if this kind of shape, secured at the bottom of the vehicle would work strength-wise or not (up to and including not deforming in a crash)? If so it would be nice to have a strong structure to use on the roof but also meaning you have the soft parts (i.e. driver etc.) of the vehicle protected by a cage without going for the whole vehicle roll cage affair, which much as I like it is a bit much for a non challenge vehicle?

Actually this is very much thinking aloud and cant see this working at the back without either stopping the rear doors opening or fouling the rear wheel if it flexes outwards??

Fact is I love the Surf and wouldnt swop it (well maybe for a Landcruiser or, well a couple of other hugely impractical vehicles) but I do get quite jealous of the landy crew with all the expedition racksa and the huge range of other extra gubbins they can easily source for their toys.

Wanders off to the corner grumbling....

[RodLeach]

Other then comfort theres not a huge amount that the surf has over anything.

An if your talking about doing full on expedition stuff... Well it wouldn't be my first, second or probably even third choice.


The roofs are weak an the panel itself is easy to dent as i found out on my old truck just putting a pair of boots up there.


Biosurf, Your rollcage idea is a good one but in a crash it would probably deform due to the fact that its just two large hoops. FIA spec rollcages always have at least one diagonal within the hoop itself. Thats the bit that stops the hoop deforming.


The suspension set up is pretty poor aswell. I dont think many can argue against that.

It might be able to handle it but probably at a severly increased risk of roll over.

I know that sounds abit anti surf... Which i guess it is

I love these trucks to bits, But they are a pi$$ poor choice expedition wise.

[JUDWAK]

I love these trucks to bits, But they are a pi$$ poor choice expedition wise.

iam planning an expedition my 2.4 may not be up for it
been looking at the G wagen

[BUSHWHACKER]

I've stood on my roofrails with the cross bars fitted, had eight 6'X6' fence panels on there too with no problem.

Just make sure the rails are fitted as close to the roof edges as possible.

[biosurf]

Biosurf, Your rollcage idea is a good one but in a crash it would probably deform due to the fact that its just two large hoops. FIA spec rollcages always have at least one diagonal within the hoop itself. Thats the bit that stops the hoop deforming.
on wise.

I was thinking something along these lines but extended backwards more with a diagonal over the roof (corner to corner) - and put cross pieces over the top of this to be able to put stuff on?

Just been wondering if you could do something like this with the middle vertical set far enough away from the body so the front doors were completely clear to open even though the rears might not be able to open ot the limit of their hinges (but enough to get in)

Not sure how much I would want it really, just one of the many hare brained ideas I toy with when I can't sleep

edit: just found that pic by image search and notice by the phtobucket address that its one of steins

[kevinturner100]

anyone got problems posting threads today, cant seem to submit new thread

[sv1000spilot]

anyone got problems posting threads today, cant seem to submit new thread

NO, just submitted one. You haven't got the word SURF in the title have you? If so that's why.

[Nick V]

I don't want to use mine for an expedition, but the way the suppliers spoke in such a negative way surprised me, especially given the fact that so many use theirs in some pretty extreme conditions, ie the outback as Apache says!

Gonna get some roof bars fitted, and will fit them as close to the edge as possible,

Cheers, Nick

[RodLeach]

A lot of people get stuck in there ways...


Land rover has a huge following. Despite the fact that reliability is sh!t.

There arguement is probably "well parts are easy to source"... "parts are cheap" etc etc.

Both valid, But who gives a sh!t.. Toyotas are made of stronger stuff an dont just drop dead.

The two issues that most people i know have with the surf are..

The fact the floor is low so your legs are almost straight out..

Rear leg room is shockingly bad...


I like the driving position but the rear leg room is crap!

[surfenstein]

firstly can i just say ########,has anyone ever cut a surf in half,apart from myself and tony N,when you do you will see,the surf has a series of five formed steel reinforcing plates along both sides of the roof,as i found out,its ###### hard to cut through,as vince said earlier if the rails are bolted in close to the edge they will be fine and they will take the weight,also vehicles that have electric sunroofs will also have extra bracing in the roof.bio good idea i wonder where you got that from,we can always fab something up for you,we have just fitted out six brand new landcruisers with self fabbed expedition roof racks for the british army.and they were chuffed to nuts.nice pic by the way,pity it dont look like that anymore,and wodderick as usual nearly right but not quite,

[RodLeach]

wodderick as usual nearly right but not quite,

maybe about the roof... But a cage with no diagonal bracing would not have fcuk all strength.

An i wont budge on them being a sh!t choice for expedition use either.

[surfenstein]

maybe about the roof... But a cage with no diagonal bracing would not have fcuk all strength.

An i wont budge on them being a sh!t choice for expedition use either.

i knew i would make you bite.the pic that bio put up of the hilux-ish is half way having the cage fabbed up so there is now x bracing and gussets on corners.

[RodLeach]

i knew i would make you bite.

S'all the pent up teen angst mate...


That an the E numbers from the meatball sub!