veg oil (ann expensive experiance)

[alf]

Hia all, just a quick warning to those who are using and those who are thinking of using veg oil. Regular readers of this forum may remember a few weeks ago i asked if anyone had a puller to remove the injector pump of my 1996 3 rd gen. I was given an idea on how to make one by someone whose name slips my memory now, ( and i thank him for this). I made it and removed the pump. It was taken to be checked out at a diesel specialist, and repaired if needed. The injectors where found to be ok, so i asked for them to be cleaned and serviced anyway. When it came to the pump i was gobsmacked at what he found. The body of the pump was worn to excess and was redused to s$$$$. And needed renewing. The inside was clogged up with small lumps of congeeled veg. I had no option but to tell the chap to get on and do what had to be done. A week later he rang to say that all was now ok, and ready to be collected. I nearly died when i got the price, but i done a cash deal with him if the vat was dropped. This he agreed to and also knocked of another £ 80 for good measure. The total i had to pay him was £ 580. A trully painfull veg oil experiance indeed. My car has only done approx 50,000 miles, so its not due to milage covered. The filter was regulary changed. I didnt use the same supplier of veg oil all the time. But the place i got most of it off also sold it to a road tanker fleet, who ran all his fleet on it. He has had no problems at all with his trucks, so it cant be that sorce. The only other private manufacture i bought it of hads a fire and closed down. But i dont think it was his oil either, as i bought very very little of him. That only leaves Tesco, Makro, Liddle and Netto that i have bought it from. I also used dino diesel from time to time when i couldnt get to the veg oil supplies. So all thoughs thinking of using it be wary. It hasnt put me off , and i support all those who want to use it to get cheaper and cleaner motoring. I am just telling you of my experiance with it so far. I wish you all safe and happy vegging. Alf

[darkdezigns]

i was bout to get my first lot at tesco!

[da SLUG man]

you only use diesel from time to time??

does that mean you were using 100% veg oil?? with no heating?


(and i wouldn't take the mileage as gospel on an import!!)

[tintin]

" I also used dino diesel from time to time when i couldnt get to the veg oil supplies."

There are so many threads on this site that tell people clearly, NOT to use 100% veg oil unless you have heaters etc.
And you dont say wether you have used only SVO or used waste veg oil, if so was it filtered correctly??????
Its nice of you to post a warning for the rest of us, but please could we have the facts?
Thanks
(dont take this the wrong way, i'm not trying to be deliberately critical!)
alan

[darkdezigns]

" I also used dino diesel from time to time when i couldnt get to the veg oil supplies."

There are so many threads on this site that tell people clearly, NOT to use 100% veg oil unless you have heaters etc.
And you dont say wether you have used only SVO or used waste veg oil, if so was it filtered correctly??????
Its nice of you to post a warning for the rest of us, but please could we have the facts?
Thanks
(dont take this the wrong way, i'm not trying to be deliberately critical!)
alan

much..............lol

[muller1]

Running on veg oil

One thing that no one seems to write about in the use of fuels other than diesel or gas oil, is the lubrication of the injector pump.
I do not know what the lubricity of the variety of raw veg fuel oils are but I am sure someone will tell me / us.
The pump used on the Surf is a rotary pump and they are designed to the bone for costs only, nothing to do with progress or economy other than the car manufacturers costs are much reduced.
The good old in line pump has it's own oil sump or feed from the engine lub oil and is not so reliant on the lubrication of the fuel being pumped.
The rotary pump has one h/p element whereas the in line has one for each cylinder and it relies on the lubricity of the type of fuel it is pumping.
This means that the rotary pump is at least four times harder worked than it's in line brother.
The loads on the internal pressure parts of the in line pump are frightening especially on the cam plate.

I would advise caution with raw veg based fuels as the pump perhaps is not a "happy puppy" pumping cooking oil.
In the correct process in "CONVERTING" veg based oils the polymers are altered and modified by a chemical process and if this was not required the converting of the veg based oil in to a bio fuel would not be required.
I would not think anyone would put the same raw veg oil in to the engine to lubricate it where the loads are a lot less than in the high pressure fuel injector pump.
I am not saying do not use veg oil but perhaps all that glistens is not gold.

Perhaps adding some lubrication oil of about 2 to 3% would help prevent the high wear on the internals of the rotary pump.

OH for the good old days of in line pumps they would pump rocks for ever.


Regards.

Mike:

[logey79]

i may be wrong, but i thought there was also an issue with the type of pump you have. i recall the situation as being - Bosch and you're ok for veg oil, but Lucas beware.

i may be completely wrong, but out of interest, what manufacturer is yours?

[TonyN]

i may be wrong, but i thought there was also an issue with the type of pump you have. i recall the situation as being - Bosch and you're ok for veg oil, but Lucas beware.

i may be completely wrong, but out of interest, what manufacturer is yours?

Surf pumps are all Denso.



Alf, I may be thinking of someone else who called me, but didn't your truck sit for a extended period, may have a lot to do with the veg going manky in the pump.

[logey79]

Surf pumps are all Denso.



.

that don't make me wrong about the Bosh - Lucas thing though, necessarily...

anyway, everyone knows not to pay attention to me!

[TonyN]

that don't make me wrong about the Bosh - Lucas thing though, necessarily...

Yeah, damn those Germans.....

[logey79]

i spelt it right earlier on....so bollicks!!!!

[MattF]

that don't make me wrong about the Bosh - Lucas thing though, necessarily...

anyway, everyone knows not to pay attention to me!

As far as I remember, the older Bosch I.P's were along the same lines as the Denso's, but the newer ones have a similar design to the Lucas pumps, so old is good and new ain't.

[Vultch]

So...do all Surfs have rotary pumps or do older Surfs have in line pumps ??

[alf]

veg oil (a painfull experiance) reply

Hia all, in reply to some of your questions about my expensive experiance. I have never used dirty unfiltered veg oil. Only refined oil. Yes my car did stand for a good few mths with out being used. When i used the veg from Tescos ect, it was with a mix of dino aswell. Not sure now of the ratio, it was some time ago now. My pump is a Denzo. I have no heating system fitted at present, but i made a stainless steel tank with a heating coil inside, that is fed by a diverted heater water system. But not yet had chance to fit it. And i dont think at this stage i will be fitting it. So it could be up for sale if anyone may be interested. It requires mounting brackets welding to it though, but i will explain my ideas to the future purchaser when i finally decide. Hope this has answered any of your questions. And in reply to Mikes long mail regarding pumps, he is so right. The inline pump is the holy grail when it comes to pumps. And when fitted to the old Gardner diesel engine that was fitted to so may things. You have something that will run for ever on anything. Alf

[chris barnes]

i have a 2.4 surf with a veg oil conversion on it with heated pipes under the bonnet its $$$$ hot bit of kit and i never had a prob with tesco oil or anyone elses to that matter here is a tip to all if you dont have a heating method of some sort t o thin the oil only use a fifty fifty mix for trouble free motoring