15mm pipe

[POPEYE]

Can anyone see a problem with useing 15mm copper tube as part (or parts ) of a veg oil fuel pipe? would that size affect the pump, could'nt see any prob but thought i'd ask, reason is i 'm going to make a water jacket'ed fuel line in certain places and it'd be easier to get 15 X 15 X 22mm tees' than 10 X15 X 22mm without extra adaptors, want to keep it to one fitting each end, Ta

[That Ruddy Squirrel]

Can anyone see a problem with useing 15mm copper tube as part (or parts ) of a veg oil fuel pipe? would that size affect the pump, could'nt see any prob but thought i'd ask, reason is i 'm going to make a water jacket'ed fuel line in certain places and it'd be easier to get 15 X 15 X 22mm tees' than 10 X15 X 22mm without extra adaptors, want to keep it to one fitting each end, Ta

I have a concern Ian, I saw this on journeytoforever.org

'Copper and SVO: "I'm not so worried about the copper but what the copper does to the fuel. Did you ever check what happened to your fuel properties like oxidation stability and acid value? A lot of research has been done in Germany on VO (and biodiesel) fuel properties, and who I consider as the leading experts clearly warn against using copper in connection with VO because of the catalytic effect it has on the VO. The laboratory ASG Analytik-Service (http://www.asg-analytik.de), who were involved in the research leading to the "Rape Seed Oil Fuel Standard", says that just a few PPM of copper in VO will change the oxidation stability... [In SVO systems] with a catalytic metal, I think you have the best conditions and environment for decomposition of the VO, and the effects it has on the fuel properties again have an impact on the engine performance, engine conditions (lifetime) and emissions composition." -- Niels Ansų, Folkecenter, Denmark'

[plumb bob]

Use plastic pipe, and brass/gunmetal compression fitings, or the push fit type.

[POPEYE]

$hite i just today made the copper heater for the tank, fitted it, sealed the tank and painted the dam thing, thanks for the heads up tho trev! dont know what else to use in place of it, dont really fancy plastic in the tank, i dunno tharwted at every turn, i know guys have made up jacket's like this before (on the forum),
How many other veg oil twin tank users have copper in the system?
think ya might have opened up a right old can of worms here trev

[plumb bob]

The modern plastic plumbing pipe is very durable, and is resistant/impervious to allsorts of chemicals, including various acids used for cleaning central heating systems, so diesel/SVO and engine coolant shouldn't be a problem.

[POPEYE]

Bob! this is what i made up and fitted today, i was bl00dy pleased with meself for getting it right first time, you know so it fitted up against the tank sides well and i did'nt have to wind the back nuts in and depress the tank to get a good seal, i'm loath to remove it as you can imagine so the question is could i make a similar thing in plastic, with the 1/2" bsp tank fittings?
i must admit i've never trusted push fit plastic fittings and always used copper for plumbing, i know these fittings have prob improved since i was "at it" and i guess what put me off plastic plumbing was the old "polyorc" stuff, the glued things, i've had some right nightmares getting called to repairs on that s**t,

[plumb bob]

Bob! this is what i made up and fitted today, i was bl00dy pleased with meself for getting it right first time, you know so it fitted up against the tank sides well and i did'nt have to wind the back nuts in and depress the tank to get a good seal, i'm loath to remove it as you can imagine so the question is could i make a similar thing in plastic, with the 1/2" bsp tank fittings?
i must admit i've never trusted push fit plastic fittings and always used copper for plumbing, i know these fittings have prob improved since i was "at it" and i guess what put me off plastic plumbing was the old "polyorc" stuff, the glued things, i've had some right nightmares getting called to repairs on that s**t,

Yeah, I've had to repair that stuff in the past, thankfully you don't see it any more round here.

Anyway, nice job there, you could replicate that with pushfit, but it may not be quite as compact, as the fittings are quite chunky.

Also the heat transference would be less due to the plastic having better insulation properties over copper.

You could take your "piece" to a plating shop and have it plated with something to resist the SVO, or maybe powder coated, I'm sure someone will be able to plate it, silver plate maybe??

[POPEYE]

Yeah, I've had to repair that stuff in the past, thankfully you don't see it any more round here.

Anyway, nice job there, you could replicate that with pushfit, but it may not be quite as compact, as the fittings are quite chunky.

Also the heat transference would be less due to the plastic having better insulation properties over copper.

You could take your "piece" to a plating shop and have it plated with something to resist the SVO, or maybe powder coated, I'm sure someone will be able to plate it, silver plate maybe??

Ah! wonder if the guy that nickel plated my vents could do that, i'll give him a ring, cheers, i did think about paint but not for long, i could see that flakeing off and blocking the pipes, silver plate eh! it aint that good

[fatfires]

Ah! wonder if the guy that nickel plated my vents could do that, i'll give him a ring, cheers, i did think about paint but not for long, i could see that flakeing off and blocking the pipes, silver plate eh! it aint that good

If you want it to last and have good heat transfer properties why not use 15mm stainless tube and fittings and silver solder or stainless mig/tig them BES stock them

[plumb bob]

If you want it to last and have good heat transfer properties why not use 15mm stainless tube and fittings and silver solder or stainless mig/tig them BES stock them

I looked at the BES stock, but the cost is hich compared with copper, and then you gotta mig it or get it migged, it might just be cheaper to get it plated.

If starting from scratch though, it would be betterr to use stainless and bend and weld,

[CaptainBeaky]

The newer plastic pipe goes to quite high pressures, and is impervious to most things.

The Marley stuff that they make down in Kent is rated at something like 16 bar, and on test has gone over 100 bar before failure (as attested by the guy who ran the QA test rig when I used to visit there a couple of years ago).

And that is pipe into fittings, not just the pipe on it's own

[RodLeach]

On a Hep2o leaflet thing, They reccommend testing to 50 bar of pressure!!!

My test gauge dont go that high!

[POPEYE]

Well it's not this twin tank stuff keeping me awake, just the usual,
thanks for the reply/advice, i think before i go to far with this i'd better check the push fit prices etc, think i can manage the coil in the tank ok and might even be ok on the heated jacket, but i'm going to have to do away with the heat exchanger from a combi i was going to use, it has a copper coil in side it, haveing filled it up with cillitt bang, it cleaned up nice tho,
might be able to work summat out useing a bit if 110mm soil pipe with cap ends (like the swirl tank the aus guy did)
i was trying to do this as cheap as poss but as usual it's escualating into big money stainless would be nice but i cant work it, (mig, bend, etc) i did look on ebay for some sort of soft (malable) alloy tube but no joy,


good night

[fatfires]

Well it's not this twin tank stuff keeping me awake, just the usual,
thanks for the reply/advice, i think before i go to far with this i'd better check the push fit prices etc, think i can manage the coil in the tank ok and might even be ok on the heated jacket, but i'm going to have to do away with the heat exchanger from a combi i was going to use, it has a copper coil in side it, haveing filled it up with cillitt bang, it cleaned up nice tho,
might be able to work summat out useing a bit if 110mm soil pipe with cap ends (like the swirl tank the aus guy did)
i was trying to do this as cheap as poss but as usual it's escualating into big money stainless would be nice but i cant work it, (mig, bend, etc) i did look on ebay for some sort of soft (malable) alloy tube but no joy,


good night

I think the plastic tube will not give you the heat transfer you need, have you concidered useing the stainless tube and fittings but joining them with resin/alaldite type adhesive. there is also a flux/solder combination paste that you can soft solder stainless

[POPEYE]

I think the plastic tube will not give you the heat transfer you need, have you concidered useing the stainless tube and fittings but joining them with resin/alaldite type adhesive. there is also a flux/solder combination paste that you can soft solder stainless

Thanks Tony, i did'nt know about the flux/solder for s/s that will do for the jacket, as for replaceing the bit i already made i remembered i have a short lenght of chrome plated copper pipe (left over from the bathroom) if i get a bag of 15mm brass comp elbows i should be able to remake it with that, may have to buy another lenght of plated pipe tho, long as i dont use the bender on it and break the chrome,
just wondering if that flux is the same stuff we used to use on "truweld" tube?
it was a cheap replacement for copper years ago, dureing the shortage, it was steel pipe with a silver (dont know what it was) coating, you could solder it to fittings etc, $hite stuff, thats where i first heard (electrolitic action) a metalic furr had blocked a c/h flow where this truweld and been soldered to copper,