an inconvienient truth

[Slugsie]

<soapbox>

Can I also point out that there is no proven cause and effect link between CO2 increase and Climate Change (Global Warming is a VERY bad name for what is happening).

Yes, CO2 levels in the atmosphere have risen, and yes, the global average temperature has risen (by 0.6 deg C since 1880 just to give you some context). However the two are not demonstrably linked in a (CO2) cause and (climate change) effect. Indeed, most studies of historical climate (from ice cores, sediments etc) show that the temperature rises first, and that CO2 level then increase.

This planet has natural hot/cold cycles that have nothing to do with anything we might have done. It is a known fact that we have been in an unusually warm period for the last 10,000 years or more, and this can in no way be contributed to anthropomorphic (I like that word) effects.

However, even given all that, I do not advocate stupidity. It is still a good idea to be prudent with the natural resources available to us, and to take sensible actions to minimise any possible impact we may have. At this time, we only have 1 planet, and we are kinda dependant on it to carry on living.

</soapbox>

[AndyLala]

And with the age of our 'choice' of vehicles...

most of the parts are now recycled through this site or ebay...
we can run on SVO if it was economically viable...
And they are still on the road... thats after 16 odd years...

But as has been said before... its my choice to drive the car I drive.

[surfstar]

Fair comments all round, where has all the snow gone?
long live the surf!

[John h]

So what is carbon neutral about a;
B52
B1b
B2
KC135
C130
F15
F16
?????????? and the list goes on ! will GB plant a tree every time a Daisy cutter is deployed ? I think Not !
I like my plastic fantastic 3RD GEN SURF and there's nothing you can do about it so there

[That Ruddy Squirrel]

Hopefully the Eco terrorists will pick up on this and leave us alone

[angusglover]

So...just to be clear about the hypocricy of all this.....are we saying that ALL eco-warrior types stay in the UK for ALL their holidays and drive there in eco friendly veg burning chariots? I think not!!!

Tony Blair keep telling us we need to be greener...then fooks off to the Bahamas on a jet!!!

If we did as those crazy eco warrior tree hugging types asked and stop using long haul flights......what would happen to the economy of the countries that rely on tourism for the mainstay of their economy?...We would end up with a new "eco disaster"...

We cannot win all wars but these people cannot have their cake and fookin eat it. We want to be more gfreen, ban flying, bollox to those countries that need it and then see what happens next..morons.

Recycle, use common sense and come up with a sensible plan....muppets.

[johnd]

I like warm ( now pass the sun block )

[Tallyman]

There is a growing number of scientists who are questioning the whole "population causing global warming" argument in favour of the one that the whole thing is caused by a variation in the energy output of the Sun.

The Sun is not currently behaving as the scientists expected. The current sunspot minimum didn't happen as they believed it would from previous studies and there have been more solar flares recently. This is the main reason why they have been launching a number of Sun studying satellites recently and they've been getting some interesting results back from them.

The claim that our output of CO2 is causing the Arctic ice to melt is $$$$$$$$. Greenland was so named for a reason. The Vikings used to live there back in the 7th/8th century because the land was fertile enough (and warm enough) to farm, grow crops, unlike now where it's mostly ice covered. They were forced to leave when the land froze back in the 9th/10th century I believe (can't remember for sure but it was on the box recently). But before then the Arctic must have been much warmer and probably far less ice covered, so the current trend is probably just a swing back the way it was 1200 years ago.

OK, humanity may not be helping the situation (there are probably 4 billion too many of us) but we are probably producing far less greenhouse gases in the UK than in many of the Third World countries. We no longer have any real manufacturing base, so the pollution that used to come from lots of factories has gone. Our means of transport are far more energy efficient now than they were 25-30 years ago, despite there being many more vehicles on the roads. Air travel has increased but even the aero engines on commercial jets are more efficient than they were 20 years ago.

Green taxes are just another excuse for the robbing $$$$$$$ in 11 Downing Street to screw even more money out of the poor taxpayer , and it's the "poor" taxpayer who pays the most, because the rich make damned sure that they pay as little as possible of there "non-hard" earned money in tax. Ordinary motorists, drinkers and smokers are those that always get hit by the Budget but it's the poor who usually have to pay for their own fuel and drink and smoke because that's one of their only "pleasures".

Not sure if there is much that we can do about global warming, other than sit it out, or all move to Scotland when it gets too hot in Kent in the summer. Apparently there's plenty of open spaces up there. Although if the Gulf Stream slows down or stops because the melting ice caps have desalinated the Arctic waters, then we won't need to worry about heat because we will lose the warm wet air that ir brings to the UK and instead we'll get more cold Arctic airstreams running down over us, making the UK much more like Scandinavia, in which case all the Scots will want to move down to Kent to get warm!!!

Or this all many just be a conspiracy by the military/industrial complex to turn us all in to mindless slaves. Blair certainly seems to be achieving this for them with his dumbing down of UK education. Soon nobody coming out of school will be able to read and write, so they'll not have a clue what is being done to them, only what they are being force fed on increasingly moronic TV reality shows.

Or there again I may just be talking b o l l o c k s!!!

[drunkmonkeyboy]

<soapbox>

Can I also point out that there is no proven cause and effect link between CO2 increase and Climate Change (Global Warming is a VERY bad name for what is happening).

Yes, CO2 levels in the atmosphere have risen, and yes, the global average temperature has risen (by 0.6 deg C since 1880 just to give you some context). However the two are not demonstrably linked in a (CO2) cause and (climate change) effect. Indeed, most studies of historical climate (from ice cores, sediments etc) show that the temperature rises first, and that CO2 level then increase.

This planet has natural hot/cold cycles that have nothing to do with anything we might have done. It is a known fact that we have been in an unusually warm period for the last 10,000 years or more, and this can in no way be contributed to anthropomorphic (I like that word) effects.

However, even given all that, I do not advocate stupidity. It is still a good idea to be prudent with the natural resources available to us, and to take sensible actions to minimise any possible impact we may have. At this time, we only have 1 planet, and we are kinda dependant on it to carry on living.

</soapbox>

HEAR HEAR

i like these likes! i feel like they are plucked right out of my head! either way the weather goes i will be ready with my surf and veg oil!!!

[Slugsie]

There is a growing number of scientists who are questioning the whole "population causing global warming" argument in favour of the one that the whole thing is caused by a variation in the energy output of the Sun.

The Sun is not currently behaving as the scientists expected. The current sunspot minimum didn't happen as they believed it would from previous studies and there have been more solar flares recently. This is the main reason why they have been launching a number of Sun studying satellites recently and they've been getting some interesting results back from them.

Very true. The Suns output is reckoned to have increased by around 0.2% in the last few hundred years. That doesn't sound much, but it is (in theory at least) sufficient to account for the observed temperature increase. 0.2% increase on the planets average temperature of 287Kelvin (14deg C) is nearly the 0.6K (or 0.6deg C, it's the same) increase that has been observed. No-one is saying that it's the sole cause, but it must be playing a significant part. It'd be a pretty arrogant environmentalist to suggest that we have managed to affect the output of the Sun!


**EDIT**
That was my eleventy eleventh post.
**/EDIT**

[skyhooked]

boats

make surfs look like sinclair C5's when it comes to, well, pollution i guess is the right word

we're just about to take delivery of an old boat next week. it has twin petrol engines

it is around 10times more THIRSTY than the surf, and its only a baby really

its a recreational item and i cant use it commercially. not saying i want the greens to come and pick on me, but, it goes to show the prejudice against 4x4 owners when people are burning hundreds a weekend

surely though, there is only a finite amount of fuel left, and it's going to get burnt one way or another right? isn't it best we get rid of it all sooner, and then the planet can start recovering sooner?

[plumb bob]

The road fund liecense on my 3 1/2 ton van is cheaper than my mums 1.6deawoo cos my emmissions are less ( according to DVLA) now my van only does 25mpg against mums 40 mpg. and yet mum fills her tank once a month and I fill mine once a week. How mental is that??

BTW surf does 18mpg at last count.