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**Morr** · 28 February 2006, 14:35

Mark,
Congratulations on the new arrival, and comiserations on the need to sell your Surf.

Its kinda hard to put a value on Surfs in Ireland these days, as with the rest of the secondhand car market, values are dropping fast with the huge volume of new cars sold (this year to date I believe we have eclipsed the previous record set in 2000).

My initial thoughts were that you might get up to �3500 for it, but a quick run thru the buy & sell shows prices continue to fall, there's a 99 fresh off the boat for �11,950 with warranty!

There has been a 96 on in for ages, hasen't sold yet at �10,800, and I've seen 2nd Gens hang round the B&S for months at prices over 4k.

Realistically, altough probably "worth" more, I reckon on the market you should advertise for around �2800 and expect to let it go for around the �2200 mark, possibly less.

Just my opinion, hope it doen't offend you or your Surf

**silvtr1000** · 28 February 2006, 17:13

Wow. I guess I expected to get less than I paid (�4000 in Feb 2004), but after replacing the bits I did, I'd hoped I'd get over �3000. I rang a local dealer today to see if he'd take it and give me a little commuter. No joy, but in the chat it turns out he has a 97 Scenic that he can do REAL cheap - cheaper than I was hoping to get for the Surf. He won't take either of my cars (94 Corolla estate & the Surf), but might hold the Scenic for me (if I give him a deposit) till the Surf is sold IF the Surf sells soon.

I guess I should pitch it at around �3000 and take the first/best offer I get. I hear you about worth vs market price, and I take no offence at all. It's a 15 year-old car sought by cult fans (not necessarily fans of The Cult), but just another unusual Jap import to most Irish folk.

Thanks for the reply Morr. Hope it sells soon. I'd hate to miss this deal on the Scenic.

Mark

**silvtr1000** · 9 March 2006, 11:01

She's gone... I got �2500 from a workmate who's always fancied it. He tried to barter based on the clutch rattle at idle, but I told him I'm not doing anything with it - �2500 as is. So he gave me a fat envelope that afternoon.

Trouble is the Scenic was a dog - burnt out clutch (rusty towball should've raised suspicion), water leak (steam cleaned engine bay made it hard to see), frontal crash damage (very well repaired/resprayed), screws on dash-top (taxi radios?), new pedal rubbers, worn seat fabric & steering wheel, but only 78,000 miles.

"Seems too good to be true? Probably is."

So I'm without a second car.

Shortlist is:

97/98 Renault Scenic from Northern Ireland or car auction in republic

92-94 Mitsubishi RVR Sports Gear (anyone know anything about these?)

97/98 Mitsubishi Space Star from Northern Ireland

Toyota Picnics are out of my budget here (under �3000), and come only in 2.0 petrol or 2.2 deisel - probably not a big difference in running costs vs a Surf.

Mark

**Morr** · 9 March 2006, 11:40

Excellent news on the sale, I reckon you did well. Pity you'll be leaving the fold, but a good result, make sure to point the new owner in the forums direction.

With regards to buying from the north, no offence to any of our northern members, but I won't touch a car from there with somebody else's 20ft barge pole. Cars from the UK in general are fine, but those from Northern Ireland do not seem to fare well.
Why? Well rust for one, like ourselves in Ireland, they tend (in general) to be a little lax on the washing/waxing/undersealing/cleaning under the vehicle side of things. This may be tolerable here, but with the salt on the roads in the north it will take its toll. The salt in England tends to be countered by better maintenance of the vehicle.
General maintenance standards of the vehicles appears to be far lower. I used to work in a (small) garage and when we seen a northern reg'd car coming in, we always knew there would be lots of work in it. Friends still in the trade tell me its still the same. I've personally seen more write-offs cosmetically tidied up and passed off as clean cars from the north than I've seen from everywhere else combined (some were really dangerous horror stories I've never seen the like of elsewhere).
I could go on, but in all honesty I can think of only one person I know who bought a car from the north and had no trouble with it, it was a 3 or 4 yr old Audi 80 from a dealer in Belfast which I collected with him, other than that all I can think of are a string of northern cars I've either earned nicely from due to the amount of work they needed doing or had to inform the owner that they were unsafe and I would have to refuse to work on them.

I know there are doubtless plenty of good vehicles available in Northern Ireland, along with many reputable dealers and owners who look after and maintain their vehicles properly, but my experiences would lead me to say a resounding no.

**hellmett** · 9 March 2006, 18:36

Re

Hi Mate,

I think your generalisation about cars from Northern Ireland is a wee bit silly mate, to be fair!

How can a car from the North be any different than a car from the South, realistically?

Salt on the roads?

If anything, up here, we don't get nearly enough grit applied when it is frosty.

I lived in Scotland and I couldn't believe the amount of grit that was applied to their roads in cold weather, it would put our roads to shame.

You seem to reckon that 2nd hand cars in EIRE are far superior to cars in the UK?

I have seen many, many a banger held together with isopon on roads in the south as I have in England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland!

It makes no difference!

You can buy a good car or a bad car from either the North or the South!

Besides, we have THE most stringent MOT available so, in theory, the cars from here should be of a higher mechanical standard than both the UK and EIRE!

You seem to think that we are unable to look after our vehicles up here which is simply not the case!

People are people, some look after their cars and some don't, the border has got nothing to do with it!

Thats like saying that cars bought in Wales are of a better standard than cars bought in Scotland.

I cannot fathom how you came to this theory at all!

BTW

Why? Well rust for one, like ourselves in Ireland, they tend (in general) to be a little lax on the washing/waxing/undersealing/cleaning under the vehicle side of things. This may be tolerable here, but with the salt on the roads in the north it will take its toll. The salt in England tends to be countered by better maintenance of the vehicle.

LOL, Are you seriously saying that the Northern Irish and Southern Irish don't wash their motors as much as the rest of the UK?

Maybe because we are picking potatos, fighting or drinking Guinness on Sunday morning when everyone in the UK is out washing and waxing their cars!

Or maybe because we are just "mingers" PMSL!

Gary

**JimL** · 9 March 2006, 23:03

The '98 Avensis is dipping into the 3 grand and a bit range now. How bout you look for a good one of those? Good family car, and you only need room for 3 in the back dont you.

**silvtr1000** · 10 March 2006, 10:49

The Avensis is lovely - I had considered these, along with Mondeos, S/V40s, Galants, etc. I'll do a bit of surfing today. The Scenic attraction stems from my wife's brother having one (albeit a gutless 1.4) which she loves - cup holders, cubby boxes LOADS of space, even with the infant seat in the middle and a booster seat each side, the fold-down trays on the backs of the front seats, twin sunroofs, blah, blah. But... it's a Renault. No-one I know supports my decision on going for a Renault. Including my Toyota main-dealer mechanic uncle, unsurprisingly.

If an Avensis proves out of budget, I may look at a Carina.

FWIW, my Surf was a NI car before I bought it - fair bit of rust under her, but nothing structural.

Mark

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