Veg oil duty

[Philip]

Just phoned department at Inland Revenue, to see what happens after they receive your application. He told me that the duty is 47p if you mix veg and diesel. I explained that i would be mixing it seperately. He said dodn't make any difference. Seemingly the veg oil must meet certain criteria. Something called ester i think also must be sulpher free. He is sending me guidelines etc.
Must have done something wrong but don't know what. Not as simple as it seems. Anyone any ideas?
Philip

[Morr]

Just phoned department at Inland Revenue, to see what happens after they receive your application. He told me that the duty is 47p if you mix veg and diesel. I explained that i would be mixing it seperately. He said dodn't make any difference. Seemingly the veg oil must meet certain criteria. Something called ester i think also must be sulpher free. He is sending me guidelines etc.
Must have done something wrong but don't know what. Not as simple as it seems. Anyone any ideas?
Philip

Don't tell em your mixin it then. The ester bit he's refering to is that to qualify it must be an ester based compund, veggie is 100% ester based it also contains 0% sulpher

[chunkymonkey]

The duty on a diesel substitute (i.e. anything that "stretches" diesel) is 47p so a diesel veg oil mix will attract 47p on the veg oil. Biofuels attract the lower duty rate of ~26p. To qualify as a biofuel it has to have a very low sulphur content and be 96% methylester. As mentioned veg oil has no sulphur and is 100% ester - However customs are not stupid - they know that you cannot run your car on straight veg oil without modifying it.

Hence to get the lower duty you either have to modify your vehicle or thin the veg oil with a solvent to enable your vehcile to run on only veg oil. Be careful with the solvents as some are taxable and some aren't. Turps Substitute (mix up to 4% with veg oil) will be ok - Do not use kerosene - even though this will work fine, as it is a fossil fuel which is marked by HM Customs and Excise. Industrial white spirit or as mentioned turps substitute will serve well.

Check out http://www.bio-power.co.uk/makeit.htm for full details.

[dirtydog]

OK got my letter from Customs also stating I will have to pay 47p/litre to mix oil/derv.
What did I say wrong? I rekon they will be slightly suspect if I let this drop then apply again?

[Philip]

Reply to Dirtydog

OK got my letter from Customs also stating I will have to pay 47p/litre to mix oil/derv.
What did I say wrong? I rekon they will be slightly suspect if I let this drop then apply again?

It would appear after talking to Customs, you must declare that the Veg oil has no Sulpher and that it is 100% ester. Also important to say you will be setting aside ever how much you will declare. Then should be OK. I am just writing letter back now. Also asked him what happens if need to put in diesel. He then said thats OK. But if you tell them you are mixing it beforehand seems thats the problem. Sounds stupid to me.
Good luck Philip

[firefly]

Hi Philip
i have just got the same reply it seems how are you wording your reply as i would ofcourse rather pay 27p duty than the 47 their asking for

[da SLUG man]

i know it's illegal to mix it with ketamine... that would just knock out all the horses.

[TonyN]

Sounds stupid to me.

There you go! C&E in a nutshell

[dirtydog]

It would appear after talking to Customs, you must declare that the Veg oil has no Sulpher and that it is 100% ester. Also important to say you will be setting aside ever how much you will declare. Then should be OK. I am just writing letter back now. Also asked him what happens if need to put in diesel. He then said thats OK. But if you tell them you are mixing it beforehand seems thats the problem. Sounds stupid to me.
Good luck Philip

Phillip can you please forward me your letter as Im not sure what to write. DO I have to say IM running 100% veg for the purposes of the form?

Ta'

[chunkymonkey]

I got another letter from C&E yesterday - apparently turps substitue isn't allowed - however if you mix veg oil and turps (but not too much has to be 96% ester) that counts as a biofuel so is ok for the lower duty.

[Philip]

Form EX103

The form i got back had 4 questions. Here are answers i put after talking to the guy at the Mineral oil relief centre.
1 Yes it meets all Specifications. No Sulpher content and is 100% Ester.
2 New Vegetable oil. Told them i have converted car to run on Veg oil. I as you might know produce Fuel Cat, well i know have a unit on my car which heats up oil before pump, so atleast if they visit, i can show them something.
3 I said minimum 100 ltrs. I work from home, so don't use much fuel.
Also asked him what happens if i run out of Veg oil and have to put in diesel. He said no problem as duty on diesel is already paid. Seems weird. If you mix it beforehand you pay higher tax, but if it mixes in the tank then its lower rate.
The main thing appears to be that you say how much Veg you are "setting aside" as that is what you are paying tax on.
Rgds Philip

[chunkymonkey]

Have you tried the fuel cat with veg oil.... would be interested in knowing if it is worth having...

[Philip]

Tony fitted unit to my car last Sunday. First thought was it felt a bit freer at top end. Hope to fit one to Linda's car, but want to put it on rolling road first and then again after fitting unit. Not many Rolling roads around Basingstoke though. If heating fuel, it must make it easier on pump. As you know fuel consumption is always better in the summer. Now tyrying to figure out cheaper way to cool oil a bit, without big outlay for oil coolers etc. I am now on 50/50 and shortly will see how we do on 80 veg.
Philip

[chunkymonkey]

Cool - keep me posted on how it goes! I will get one if it makes a difference.

[dirtydog]

What they said to me is this...

The method you describe mixing vegetable oil with regular diesel, would make you a fuel substitute producer. Duty on the product will normally be due at the rate applicable to the fuel it substitutes for e.g. Ultra Low Sulphur Diesel (currently £0.4710)

Letter was from ***** ***, is that who you spoke to Phillip?