Intercoolers

[waveydavey]

Has any one given any thought to fitting an intercooler, i know ther was a thread on the old sirte but don,t know what transpired??
Cheers Dave

[4 Runner]

Intercoolers

Dave

If you drop these guys a line they may be able to help you out they do updated ones for Land Cruises

http://www.allisport.com/home.php

Pete

[Guest]

Dave

If you drop these guys a line they may be able to help you out they do updated ones for Land Cruises

http://www.allisport.com/home.php

Pete

Also 4 Counties might be worth a call, seem to remember something about them doing one.

Cheers

[Jonnyboy]

Do the benefits of an intercooler outweigh the costs involved in a retro fit??

[Guest]

Do the benefits of an intercooler outweigh the costs involved in a retro fit??

Depends how much you want the increase on Power and Torque. It will prbably cost around a grand to fit an intercooler so you aren't going to recoup your costs by the small increase in fuel economy so it is really only viable as a relatively high cost performance upgrade. You can probably get as good performance improvements with a large diameter exhaust (the 2 1/2 inch one from a 3L) and a decent aftermarket airfilter like a K&N.

For me unless I could get an intercooler from a scrapped Prado or late 3rd Gen and use the bits and some ingenuity to make it fit, I wouldn't bother.

Thats just my opinion though.

Cheers

[waveydavey]

intercoolers

Thats more like it a scrapped Prado sounds good to me, just the kind of challenge i like mind you on the allisports site they were talking about remapping the engine after fitting an intercooler.
This seems unneccessary to me as what you get with an intercooler is a drop in temp of the pre combustion air making it denser, therefore you get more power from the Same amout of fuel.. or am i being too simplistic.
I am off to find an intercooler that will go in front of my rad,no it won,t cause a problem with cooling cos i will use a coarse fin set up.
Regards Dave

[redneck]

Try looking on www.howstuffworks.com they have a good explanation of what a turbo and intercooler actually does.

Basically you are right, it cools the air making it more dense hence for a given volume you get more mass, in effect more air going in, so you can have a smaller turbo - if you want a smaller one that is!

Redneck

[TonyN]

This seems unneccessary to me as what you get with an intercooler is a drop in temp of the pre combustion air making it denser, therefore you get more power from the Same amout of fuel.. or am i being too simplistic.

A little Generally, a motor's ECU moniters air temps, amount of air, throttle openings, fuel being supplied, inlet vacuum, etc all the time to getthe motor running its best, alter one of these settings and it will confuse the computer and mess up the fueling settings at best, at worst will throw an engine check light at you and shut the motor down cos it thinks something is broken.

Some makes of car will let you get away with quite a bit of tuning, others, like the newer Jaguars, will flash an engine check light if you use a non-Jaguar set of spark plugs.

[crusty]

I've done a fair bit of turbo/performance work with my MX6, I'd say the basics are the same, be it for a petrol or deisel. I don't actually know what psi our turbo boosts at.

[disclaimer]I have not performed any turbo work on a deisel [disclaimer]
What TonyN said is basicly correct, although air temps, throttle pos, etc. are all variable anyway and is is the ECU's primary objective to adjust fuel supply to suit. (once again...I don't have an intimate knowledge of the Surfs ECU or sensors)
An intercooler will (obviously) reduce the charge temp,(more dense air =more air = more fuel required) Assuming our injectors & pump can cope with the extra amount of fuel they need to flow(I don't know what % of duty cylce they run at stock) it will be ok.This happens naturally anyway with seasonal changes. My MX6 happily boosts at 12psi on a cold morning but struggles to get 9 on a hot day.

Another consideration is that more volume between the turbo & inlet manifold, which would occur with the extra piping and the intercooler itself,usually means more lag. Also, intercoolers, depending on design, can actually loose up to 2psi between inlet/outlet due to their restictive design. There are definate benifits from a cooler charge, but you should be aware there are many other factors involved.
Easier & cheaper mods would include: Simply increasing the diametre of the dump (exhaust) pipe out of the turbo will bring boost on lower in the rev range, also improving the intake with a free flowing filter and a cold air intake will improve performance significantly. Manual boost controllers are general more reliable than Solinoid actuated ones at reducing boost spikes and maintaining boost by reducing "wastegate creep". ALWAYS fit a boost gauge before you fit a boost controller.

You must have a different engine bay than mine, because i have stared blankly for hours , trying to figure out where all the extra plumbing would fit for a front mount intercooler.

Ok, this is probably getting for you all so I'll stop.
Can anyone tell me what std psi the 2.4l surf boosts at?
Also remember higher psi = more chance of headgasket failure

Good luck with your mod and make sure you post some pics.

Jim

[andy]

The standard boost for a 2.4 is 7psi , and the ECU will shut the motor down at just over 12psi .

[Guest]

The standard boost for a 2.4 is 7psi , and the ECU will shut the motor down at just over 12psi .

I've heard of people buying adjustable wastgate controllers and running up tp 16psi and beyond on the 2.4 - I presume you need to remap the ECU or fool it.

Cheers

[crusty]

Thanx Andy, that's a coincedence my mazda factory boost is 7 with fuel cut @12psi. Do many people go down the road of increasing boost on the Surf? I've never really contemplated any performance mods for the Surf(I've had it for 4 years), I seem to spend all my time making my MX6 quicker.
Cheers
Jim.
*edit* too slow with the post!!! damn, dial up is slow. I'm usually posting when all you guys are tucked up in bed.
How reliable is the HG with that kind of boost?

[crusty]

At 16psi wouldn't the charge would be so hot (even with a small intercooler) you'd almost be losing the benifit of more air.???

[andy]

This is where I got the information from , but from what it say's the 2.4 will boost a bit higher , it's the 3.0 that the ECU will cut out after 12psi .


http://pub12.ezboard.com/ftoyotasurf...icID=614.topic

[Guest]

Thanx Andy, that's a coincedence my mazda factory boost is 7 with fuel cut @12psi. Do many people go down the road of increasing boost on the Surf? I've never really contemplated any performance mods for the Surf(I've had it for 4 years), I seem to spend all my time making my MX6 quicker.
Cheers
Jim.
*edit* too slow with the post!!! damn, dial up is slow. I'm usually posting when all you guys are tucked up in bed.
How reliable is the HG with that kind of boost?

I Don't think it's that much of a common mod and personally I would'nt bother. I'd much rather have reliability than more power. The Surf has plenty of grunt for good off road use as a number of people showed at the Devil's Pit last weekend. Traction is more of an issue and a much better thing to spend you're money and time on.

If I wanted more power my approach would be to put a Small Block Chevy engine in (It would be complex but it has been done - at least I've seen a site with a Surf fitted with a Small Block Ford 5.0 SHO V8 in it). That way you get all the reliability in the world (You can't break a 350ci Chevy) and enough power and torque to snap the chassis in half.

Cheers