Just how smokey should a surf be?

[The Typsey Russell]

I understand that I have a diesel engine and that these will produce a little smoke, but......

How smokey should they actually be?

I have the dreaded '92 2.4 2LT-E Engine and it gives me a little smoke on start up, nothing excessive, but when I accelerate away (I mean flooring it) it smokes quite a lot until I settle on a speed to cruise at.

Is this indicative of a problem or is it to be expected?

Cheers.

[gemini]

I understand that I have a diesel engine and that these will produce a little smoke, but......

How smokey should they actually be?

I have the dreaded '92 2.4 2LT-E Engine and it gives me a little smoke on start up, nothing excessive, but when I accelerate away (I mean flooring it) it smokes quite a lot until I settle on a speed to cruise at.

Is this indicative of a problem or is it to be expected?

Cheers.

dont worry about it, they do tend to blow a bit of smoke when you floor the pedal, the main thing is it passing the emission test, a set of injectors will cure the problem, they are firing more diesel in than it can burn, diesel treatment sometimes reduces the smoke a bit but wont cure it if its the injectors, take them out and have them tested, they should emit a fine spray, when they are worn they tend to drip as well hence the smoke, any diesel specialist will test them for you, and recon them if needed, look in yellow pages for one in your area, probably improve mpg too if you get them done

[The Typsey Russell]

Thanks. Still a bit of novice when it comes to things like this.

[super8simon]

Russell,

sorry to bust in on your post, but I was having similar thoughts myself. Mine tends to belch out quite a bit of smoke on start up but seems fine after that. Should I be worried?? (91 2.4 TD)

Simon

[Guest]

On Startup if the smoke is black, it's unburnt fuel caused by the fuel not igniting well when the engine is cold. This is why there are glowplugs on the engine. However when starting from cold don't just wait for the glow plug lamp to go out, wait for the ignition on buzzer to sound and then start the engine with NO throttle. Should be a smoke free start.

If the smoke is blue, it's oil smoke, could be rings on the way out or more likely turbo seals weaping. Neither of these should be too much to concern you as the engine will run on for a long time if they are just weeping a bit, however if the blue smoke is all the time then it's major rebuild of the top end time.

If the smoke is white, it's steam caused by water in the combustion chamber - either bad fuel or more likely head gasket or head.

I wouldn't worry about black smoke too much as all diesels do it, even new ones - just look at the buses and taxis in london. Also Smoke under accelleration is to be expected as the pump loads more fuel sometimes than can be burnt. One final thing, excessive black smoke while driving rather than on startup is generally due to injectors on the way out. The springs that activate and close the injectors get lazy in the end and allow fuel to dribble past. This does not get burnt in the normal cycle and just get slightly burnt and ejected as black sooty deposits. Injectors can also get dirty and the needle valves not seat correctly again allowing the dreaded dribble.

A bottle of redex in a 1/4 tank of fuel and a swift thrash up the motorway (obviously at less than 71mph ) will often clean them out enough to get rid of the smoke in a large part although you will never completely get rid of it.

Cheers

[super8simon]

smoke on start up can sometimes be the valve seals letting oil past into the cylinders, is it just in the morning it does it

not just in the morning, but not all the time either, I'd say only about half the time, but then maybe I only notice it half of the time!
What d'ya think?
Thanks Gemini

Simon

[super8simon]

On Startup if the smoke is black, it's unburnt fuel caused by the fuel not igniting well when the engine is cold. This is why there are glowplugs on the engine. However when starting from cold don't just wait for the glow plug lamp to go out, wait for the ignition on buzzer to sound and then start the engine with NO throttle. Should be a smoke free start.

If the smoke is blue, it's oil smoke, could be rings on the way out or more likely turbo seals weaping. Neither of these should be too much to concern you as the engine will run on for a long time if they are just weeping a bit, however if the blue smoke is all the time then it's major rebuild of the top end time.

If the smoke is white, it's steam caused by water in the combustion chamber - either bad fuel or more likely head gasket or head.

I wouldn't worry about black smoke too much as all diesels do it, even new ones - just look at the buses and taxis in london. Also Smoke under accelleration is to be expected as the pump loads more fuel sometimes than can be burnt. One final thing, excessive black smoke while driving rather than on startup is generally due to injectors on the way out. The springs that activate and close the injectors get lazy in the end and allow fuel to dribble past. This does not get burnt in the normal cycle and just get slightly burnt and ejected as black sooty deposits. Injectors can also get dirty and the needle valves not seat correctly again allowing the dreaded dribble.

A bottle of redex in a 1/4 tank of fuel and a swift thrash up the motorway (obviously at less than 71mph ) will often clean them out enough to get rid of the smoke in a large part although you will never completely get rid of it.

Cheers

Humm, it's white smoke. Only really appears on startup and disappears with a couple of taps on the throttle. How can I tell if it's the gasket or head? It seems to run ok, sits in traffic on the daily commute, no probs on motorways, and the temp needle doesn't move, but from what I've read that doesn't seem to matter much. It does seem a little sluggish at times, but then I've never driven anything like this before so I have nothing to compare it to. Oh, and I've done the redex thing. Been through a couple of bottles since I got the truck about three weeks ago (hefty amounts in a quater tank etc.)

Any help grately appreciated.

Simon

[Guest]

Humm, it's white smoke. Only really appears on startup and disappears with a couple of taps on the throttle. How can I tell if it's the gasket or head? It seems to run ok, sits in traffic on the daily commute, no probs on motorways, and the temp needle doesn't move, but from what I've read that doesn't seem to matter much. It does seem a little sluggish at times, but then I've never driven anything like this before so I have nothing to compare it to. Oh, and I've done the redex thing. Been through a couple of bottles since I got the truck about three weeks ago (hefty amounts in a quater tank etc.)

Any help grately appreciated.

Simon

Best thing to do is to get a pressure test done. It may be just condensation forming from water in the fuel (all fuel has a small amount in it (leaky tanks at the petrol stations mainly). I'd get the test done anyway, if the head is gone or the gasket you should be able to get it done on the warranty if you got one with the car and it's a decent one.

Cheers

[super8simon]

Cheers Andy, will do. Pronto!

Simon

[Andy W]

To The Typsey Russell

What do you mean the "Dreaded" 2.4td engine ????? I have this engine and it's perfect. Don't be put off by cylinder head problems as it happens on the 3ltr as well. Also happens on many other vehicles. The answer is to give her regular fluid changes and a proper service and they will be good for 300,000 miles !!

Theres nothing at all wrong with the 2.4 engine, don't be put off !!

Andy

[Koi]

Cheers Andy, will do. Pronto!

Simon

One last thing, have you emptied the water reservoir on the fuel filter
cause a while ago mine gave out some white smoke and on the old forum someone suggested this to me and drained the water reservoir and no more white smoke. Maybe just full so moisture not being taken out of the fuel.
I think there should be a warning light to say its full but it worked on mine and never had white smoke since

[super8simon]

One last thing, have you emptied the water reservoir on the fuel filter
cause a while ago mine gave out some white smoke and on the old forum someone suggested this to me and drained the water reservoir and no more white smoke. Maybe just full so moisture not being taken out of the fuel.
I think there should be a warning light to say its full but it worked on mine and never had white smoke since

Cheers Koi, I'll give that a go. Is it a tricky job? Not known for my spanner skills.

Simon

[Koi]

Cheers Koi, I'll give that a go. Is it a tricky job? Not known for my spanner skills.

Simon

no not difficult, on the bottom of the filter is plastic thumb turn type of nut (usually white). undo this a couple of turns and then pump the plunger on top of the filter until diesel runs through if it dont undo the nut a bit more until it does. Once diesel runs through do it back up job done.

[super8simon]

Thanks Koi

Simon

[The Typsey Russell]

To The Typsey Russell

What do you mean the "Dreaded" 2.4td engine ????? I have this engine and it's perfect. Don't be put off by cylinder head problems as it happens on the 3ltr as well. Also happens on many other vehicles. The answer is to give her regular fluid changes and a proper service and they will be good for 300,000 miles !!

Theres nothing at all wrong with the 2.4 engine, don't be put off !!

Andy

Sorry Andy,

I love the thing, I really do, it's just that I am off to Scotland next week and after reading some of the threads I am getting a little bit worried. I have visions of the thing blowing up!!

Thanks to everyone for the replies.

Typsey