1st very bad day with my new surf

[jaydee]

After looking for a long time, I finally took the plunge yesterday and picked up a surf from a private sale in Derby.

Upon arriving to pick it up all things seemed to be as per the advert, I noticed a few dings that didnt show up on the pictures in the ad, but as I was getting what I considered a very good deal price wise I took them in my stride.

All the important bits worked fine, no real obvious problems there. The back window worked fine, all the electrics worked great, no slow back windows etc.

I took it for a drive and the only obvious fault was the clonking on full lock which I knew was no biggy.

So did the deal and handed the cash over. The drive back to Leicester is about 60 miles so I was looking forward to giving her a good run. I was very pleased with the power that the surf provided (never had a 4x4 before) and all in all enjoyed the drive, Until...........

Just before junc 22 of the M1 with 50 miles done, the check engine light came on so I pulled up on the hard shoulder really quickly.

As i came to a rest a ton of steam plummed out from the passenger side of the bonnet, and upon further inspection the overflow pipe that goes to the header tank had blown off and was spuing steam out everywhere.

I was more than a little $$$$ed off as you can imagine. I called the AA and they brought a truck out to get me off the motorway.

The guy from the AA then re-filled the rad (heaters on, engine running) and did a lot of checks to see if the HG had gone or maybe the head itself.

The pressure check came out fine and the check for exhaust gasses came out clear too. We rplaced the rad cap as a matter of course and agreed that this was most likely the problem.

The surf then sat there for nearly an hour, idling with all the gauges fine and tons of hot air coming out of the heaters.

He did find a few pin hole leaks on top of the radiator, these were repaired.

With that I drove the last 10 miles home with no problems at all, so just put it down to the rad cap.

That night i had to make a trip (bout 15miles each way) so sure that it was just the rad cap that caused the problem I took the surf. No issues on the way there, and none for most of the way back. Then with 3 miles to go I noticed a wurring noise that i'd not heard yet.. At first I thought it was the tyres on the road surface then I looked at the temp gauge and it was almost in the red so i pulled up really quickly again.

As soon as i stopped the same thing happened as before, loads of steam everywhere and the header cap was off blowing steam out of the overflow.

I let it cool down for half an hour then refilled the rad to get me home.

So it wasn't the rad cap causing the problem after all. This weekend I'm going to replace the rad and thermostat to see what that does, I'm just hoping its not the HG or even worse the head. Not sure how it could be though as this checked out as fine the first time round.

I know there are a lot of topics on this issue on the forum but just wondered if anyone could shed any light on this. Also am I on the right track with rplacing the thermostat? and could a knackered radiator cause this?

All in all a very bad start to my surf ownership, but hey I had 3 HG's on my other car last year so seems par for the course

[Vagrant No2]

I had a prob with the rad on my vehicle , not a 3.0 Surf . The rad cap fitment was slightly bent so the cap would pop off . I had to tweek the tabs on the rad where the cap locks into the rad when fully home and this stopped it poping off and dumping the coolant .
This is only an idea for you to check before spending out on alot of unecessary parts .
Change the stat and give it a flush aswell to make sure the system is clean and new.

[Morr]

It could of course be a number of things, its hard to be specific as I can't spot any details of which year/model/engine Surf you're referring to in your post or profile.

Check the operation of the viscous coupled fan. Check between the main radiator and the aircon rad in front, its not unknown for this gap to become full of mud and crud preventing proper airflow thru the rad.

It it an automatic or manual, auto's in particular can suffer from blockages in the rad due to the siting of the atf cooler in the base of the rad.

[BUSHWHACKER]

The whirring is the electric cooling fan behind the grille.

[DaveD]

My rad went on the way up to Wales...pinholes around the top near cap. $$$$ starting after rad replaced but when started would run sweet. After loads of running around and advice from here there and everywhere (and getting poor Tony soaked) it turned out that CHG had gone. If after burping, changing rad cap and thermostat, it still heating up and using water it'll likely be the gasket.

[Gamedawn]

I know this is probably a stupid question but are the fan belts all ok and going round?

[jaydee]

cheers for the replies guys. Its a 94 3.0 TD.

Viscous fan coupling seems to be ok, what are the other belts i need to check?

Gonna flush it out now and see what comes out.

[joker??]

hope it all works out ok .....and cheap

[jaydee]

Not got the right size socket to take the undertray off so fell at the first hurdle.. why o why do I allways loose the 13mm socket?

Things i've noticed though

- It took a lot of turning over to start (possibly from moisture in the bores???)
- Although the front heaters were blowing really hot, i couldnt get the rear ones to blow hot for about half an hour of ticking over. Lots of big air bubbles were coming out all of the time when i 'burped' it with the throttle.

- Took it for a very quick spin round the block and the temp gauge was all over the place. Never went above the middle but dropped right to the left and swang back a lot.

- My guess is there's still a lot of air in it

Gonna pick my propper tool kit up later and have another go at flushing and bleeding it.

[shaggy]

Not got the right size socket to take the undertray off so fell at the first hurdle.. why o why do I allways loose the 13mm socket?

Things i've noticed though

- It took a lot of turning over to start (possibly from moisture in the bores???)
- Although the front heaters were blowing really hot, i couldnt get the rear ones to blow hot for about half an hour of ticking over. Lots of big air bubbles were coming out all of the time when i 'burped' it with the throttle.

- Took it for a very quick spin round the block and the temp gauge was all over the place. Never went above the middle but dropped right to the left and swang back a lot.

- My guess is there's still a lot of air in it

Gonna pick my propper tool kit up later and have another go at flushing and bleeding it.

sounds rather familier
but from what ive read on here it sounds like its air locked
dont run it till you know what the prob is m8
mine had bubbles but when they popped mine had exhaust gas in them
i know what you are feeling at the moment but even if it comes to the worst case cenario (new head) then take it to stevo at manchester or tony n darn sarf and get it done right
stevo not only sorts the water system out he also checks the stat , cap , upgrades the viscous fan by altering when it spins , and fits a sensor to the head so you and him can see just how hot it all gets
ok its £1200 + the dreaded vat but then when like me you have been eating beans on toast for the next 2 months you will have a smile a mile wide

there is one thing i will say though the smile has come back again and although my eyes are firmly on the temp gauge and water im sure its gonna be fine im even smiling now

good luck mate and i do really hope its an airlock and you have many years of trouble free motoring


oh p.s.
ive got a cheep head for sale on ebay at the moment

[kitesurf_phil]

If the gas test didn't show any combustion gases and the oil hasn't turned to cream, I would say that you just need to chase out an air lock. I have had the same symptoms twice on my 2.4. Once after overheating, due to a rad with clogged mud and refilling. The second time was due to poor preperation before a long trip with the caravan. On both occasions the temp guage was wandering and the front and rear heaters were alterately hot.
I have found that after topping up the coolant, it is best to take it for a run and let it cool, then go through the topping up process again, squeezing the hoses and blipping the throttle. They are a bugger to chase the air out of.

Best of luck with it.

[jaydee]

thanks again for the responses guys, much appreciated

Just want to check I've got the rad fill procedure right. I have the surf on an inclined driveway, with the rad as the highest point. All heaters on. Then fill up rad and blip the throttle until the air bubbles stop.

Assuming thats right there are a few observations i made yesterday when flushing it out. The water that came out from the bottom of the rad was dark brown, which i think is just rust from the rad, but there was some evidence of oil in it when i looked at the drive afterwards (the puddles had a rainbow in them). When 'burping' it with the throttle there was some back pressure, but mainly when a big set of air bubbles came out.

I have a mechanic friend locally who has put quite a few cylinder heads on surfs so i'm gonna drop it in with him to see what he thinks.

There's one thing really bugging me and thats that the heater was on full hot when i picked the car up, and it was quite a warm day. Of course it could just be a coincidence but it does make me wonder if the chap i bought it off knew there was a problem.

Will report back when I know more

[spans]

Hi Jaydee,

Sorry to hear about your fun and games, with a new purchase, thats out of order m8.
I am in leicester too, if I can be of help let me know, I don't know too much about these beasts yet, but I am learning all the time (mostly with broken knuckles, brusies, and blood loss!), but if you are ever around the narborough road area, drop me a line, and pop round for a cuppa!
Hi Jaydee,

Sorry to hear about your fun and games, I am in Leicester too, if I can be of help let me know, I don't know too much about these beasts yet, but I am learning all the time (mostly with broken knuckles, bruises, and blood loss!), but if you are ever around the narborough road area, drop me a line, and pop round for a cuppa!

Send me a pm , and I’ll pm back with numbers. I hope to see you around Leicester in the future, that’s if my car is running !!

[BUSHWHACKER]

That echo's back again!

[jaydee]

thats a very kind offer spans.. As soon as I dare take it more than a mile I'll pop over for a cuppa

My mate cant get to look at it till tuesday so gonna change the thermostat as soon as i can get hold of one and see if that helps.

Something which is puzzling me is that with the rad cap on whilst idling the overflow pipe into the header is like a little bubble machine. It sat there bubbling away for 1/2 an hour earlier with no apparent end.

Could this be exhaust gasses going through the water system maybe?

its eirher that or there's more air than water in the system cos it just doesnt seem to stop.