Crunching

[Carl-P]

Hi fellas!

Was directed to this forum by a friendly character on the Difflock site.
Hope everyones well?

Ive a 2.4 Hilux pickup, probably not a million miles difference to the Surf.
Anyhow i have a question as i have had some rescent noise issues but now something terrible has become apparent.
When i pop the box into 4x4 it makes some clunky whining noises when on overrun, and whats worse is when i stop to select reverse and start to move backwards the vehicle jumps from siezure lock to fee jumping with the most amazing clunking sound ive heard.
Does anyone know which differential or box sounds like its gone?

Any thoughts apart from torching it appreciated, ive already thought about that one lol.
Cheers, Carl

[marky]

Have you been using 4x4 on the TARMAC

[BUSHWHACKER]

Have you checked the oil levels?

[Carl-P]

Yeah checked the oil and yes ive used the 4x4 on local rough roads having some sideways fun in it in the snow n mud weve had.
Backing it on the drive today was whitnessed by a mate who told me the crunchin was coming from the front Diff. Hes told me whilst watchin the Rugby this afternoon to take it to a bloke he knows of in Altrincham whos apparently **** ot in 4x4 issues.
If you can imagine lobbing a spanner into the path of a locomotives wheel, then thats what the crunch sounds like per second in reverse or on lock in 4x4.

[TonyN]

Hard to tell without seeing it, sounds like seriously screwed UJ's, or front diff has died.

Could be Birfields, but they will feel nasty even in 2wd unless the front hubs are unlocked.

Try it in 4wd with the front hubs unlocked, then in 2wd in the hubs locked to get different parts of the drive train working on there own to help isolate the problem.

No problems at all in 2wd?

[Carl-P]

Cheers for the reply,

The only problem i get in 2WD is after 55-60mph where a whurmer accurs, like the sound of a wheel bearing thats dies but ive replaced them very recently. On friday i took the time to strip the NS hub once again to investigate, i even pulled the driveshaft out again for inspection and put it back 180 degrees the opposite side in just incase that was bent and causing some grief but to no avail. I did remove one of the tin shims from the lower knuckle point, i removedthe slimmest one which has tightened up any top to bottom motion that was there nicely but again the noise persists.
The tyres were also re balanced on friday.

In 4WD it doesnt matter whether its in the high or low ratios really, its just the crunching that gets faster. The sound is definately metal dogs on dogs to some description.

Any idea if its just the Diff what this is likely to cost? Do they come in reconditioned form or just breakers?

Thanks again, Carl

[TonyN]

I assume its a 8" diff, seeing as you mention the knuckle, find out what gear ratio you have and see whats around, I have a couple of diffs here.

Front diffs are the same as rears for solid axle trucks.

[trevdowle]

locking front hubs

Hard to tell without seeing it, sounds like seriously screwed UJ's, or front diff has died.

Could be Birfields, but they will feel nasty even in 2wd unless the front hubs are unlocked.

Try it in 4wd with the front hubs unlocked, then in 2wd in the hubs locked to get different parts of the drive train working on there own to help isolate the problem.

No problems at all in 2wd?

Could you please explain to a new Surfer more about the locking/unlocking front hubs. Whats it for and how does it work ?

Thanks

Trev Dowle

[BUSHWHACKER]

All explained here mate.......

http://www.4x4toys.co.uk/axles&diffs.html

http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/add/index.htm

[TonyN]

Could you please explain to a new Surfer more about the locking/unlocking front hubs. Whats it for and how does it work ?

Thanks

Trev Dowle

No point mate, you don't have them!

But see Vince's links to find out more.

Some people retro fit them to surfs, mostly if you want lift the truck by adjusting the torsion bars, also it can help MPG in a minor way as it stop the front shafts and diff turning while in 2wd. But you lose the ability to shift in to 4wd while moving, (unless you leave them locked of course) as you need to get out and manually lock the hubs before drive will reach the front wheels.

[Carl-P]

Thanks fells, them hub explanation sheets are really informative and have put a few ghosts to rest with my trucks dialema.
Ive just been testing whats what, and ive found that in any 4x4 arrangement (Hub free or lock) in both circumstances in reverse i get severe clunking especially when i turn the steering to an angle.
Ive had the drivers door open hanging on as i slowly make a manouvre and the noise from drivers seat is dominant from the front OFFSIDE. Its clanging and clunking, locking up and freeing itself under protest.

[TonyN]

Thanks fells, them hub explanation sheets are really informative and have put a few ghosts to rest with my trucks dialema.
Ive just been testing whats what, and ive found that in any 4x4 arrangement (Hub free or lock) in both circumstances in reverse i get severe clunking especially when i turn the steering to an angle.
Ive had the drivers door open hanging on as i slowly make a manouvre and the noise from drivers seat is dominant from the front OFFSIDE. Its clanging and clunking, locking up and freeing itself under protest.

I reckon you've lunched a Birfield joint if its not the diff.

[Carl-P]

At last its looking bright for the pickup.
I took it this afternoon to the bloke who was reccomended to me. Hes played about with the vehicle and its going in to be stripped and fixed the week after next. Turns out the offside hub even when in manual position is locking on and it sounds like a tooth or two has been ripped from the diff, but eitherway ive been assured itll be a quick turn around as the parts are at hand only a few mile up the road where needed.
Would have liked to have gotten to the bottom of it myself but sometimes you have to hand it over dont ya in life, lol.

[joe112]

At last its looking bright for the pickup.
I took it this afternoon to the bloke who was reccomended to me. Hes played about with the vehicle and its going in to be stripped and fixed the week after next. Turns out the offside hub even when in manual position is locking on and it sounds like a tooth or two has been ripped from the diff, but eitherway ive been assured itll be a quick turn around as the parts are at hand only a few mile up the road where needed.
Would have liked to have gotten to the bottom of it myself but sometimes you have to hand it over dont ya in life, lol.

Was it Craig you Took it too at Altrincham Auto Services... If so He's great... Sorted My Surf out a few times and he does 4wd ing himself!

Where abouts in south Manc are you... I'm in Baguley, Off Hall Lane near tesco's

[Carl-P]

Hiya Joe.

Yes it is Craig its going to at the old Cartlidges yard, he must be well known it seems for 4x4s eh
He said its no big affair and he can get it sorted as soon as he pulls the driveshafts out n sees exactly whats what.
Currently im driving it to hartford (Northwich) n back daily which is doing my head in with the noise and vibration with this problem the truck has.
He seemed sure the offside hub was locking on, although id agree with what ive read on here i wouldnt be supprised if the diff is goosed somehow too, it clunks and clangs, whuurs away and locks up at daft times, esp in 4WD.
I can strip bikes and bike engines all day for fun but pulling the driveshafts out time again trying to find fault is beyond fun. Its somewhat annoying lol.

Im new to 4x4 offroading btw, i used to be a member of the (TRF/ Trail Riders Fellowship) and go all over the show sinking my old Honda XR600 for fun, but i wasnt always familiar with the 4x4s.
Occasionaly tho i did help one or two out of the rutts in Derbyshire on the green lanes, especially Sillydale, i couldnt believe anyone would walk a dog down there (even tho i rode a bike down n up it) nevermind a landrover. Honestly 50 degree inverts n 2 blokes kneedeep in crud wondering if theyll ever see their landrover on tarmac ever again without having to dismantle it n carry it to the top in bits.
Im told of a quarry at Rochdale thats 3/4 dry, do you know of it and go there atall?

Cheers Carl

Ps live not far from Wheatsheaf