Dealing with main dealers...

[Triv]

Hi all,
I have a question relating to gen 3 rear axles.

In October I bought a gen 3 and took it straight to a Toyota specialist for an appraisal. All was looking good other than a rear axle oil leak. The specialist (ex Toyota) told me to take it to the main dealer for the axle seal, so I did and in November and nearly £500 later it was fixed.

A couple of weeks later I returned it to the dealer as I thought it was still leaking oil but was told no it isn't, its just burning off the old oil that couldn't be cleaned out of the axle, so don't worry about it.
It stank of gear oil every time I drove it.

On Monday, I drove 15 miles to work, got out the car and thought it was on fire! The nearside rear wheel, where the seal was replaced, was hot, covered in oil with the tyre spraying oil over the underneath of the truck, brake drum covered in oil and clouds of smoke pouring out from under the wheel arch.

So yesterday I took it back again. They had a look, charged me a pound for a doughnut while I waited and told me that yes it had failed again but due to the rear nearside diff lock jamming on. Which had nothing to do with the work that they had done in November and was another failure.

Now, I don't know much about these vehicles and even less about four wheel drive but something sounds and feels unbelievably fishy to me.

Can anybody help me understand the rear axle / four wheel drive system better, so that I don't feel so ripped off, or so that I know they don't know what they're talking about, or so that I can go back in there with the knowledge to make than look a bit daft? Please?
The gearbox is a 340F and the axle is an A02A. The vehicle has multimode.

I don't really want to pay out a small fortune for them to correct their own mistakes.
Help!

Thanks.

[tashtego]

Hi,

I had a weeping rear axle (passenger's side) and got a mechanic to fix it using the Roughtrax kit. There are 5 o 6 bits altogether: bearing, seals,retainers etc. It turned out a lot cheaper than £500.

I'm thinking that they bodged the job in the first place, which is easy to do because it's a tricky job. The story about the old oil burning doesn't make sense to me: after a quick clean I had no oil left kicking about (and my diff had lost about 1/4 of a liter of oil!). Also I have never seen a 3rd Gen with a rear lockable diff. It's something you would have to buy and fit, not standard.

My gut feeling is that they didn't do the job properly and they are making things up as they go along.

Someone with more knowledge will hopefully come along.

Cheers

[JAS82N]

Old V New

I love my Toyota's

Mainly due to the lack of need to visit a garage / Dealer ship

Dealers are trained on the latest equipment on the latest vehicles, you don't find many old scholl mechanics at a dealer ship (generally)

After experiances of using Dealer ships, to buy a car / truck, no problem Good after care etc etc,

However with my old truck, I will avoid like the plague, Fixed price servicing and coolant changes, I will still use for but not investgative and fixing, They only use Authorised parts which often for our trucks are from Japan (expensive), the Hourly rate is extortionate and time to do is forever,

Example : I had a problem with my Rear Window, wanted a couple of hrs to diagnose, If parts needed order from Japan - The part I found to be wrong after using this site was the relay in the rear Quarter, would have been over £400 through dealer, Cost me £3.98 for x2 new relays from maplins and i bit of soldering,

Personally I dont think they would have bodged your vehicle, More likely to charge you for extra work than short cut and bodge, Just my opinion

[Triv]

Thanks for both answers.
I kinda feel that both answers are valid.
I'm not sure that they'd bodge it but I do think that they might forget bits.
I know not to use main dealers normally, I contribute a lot to one of the Mercedes-Benz forums and those main dealers have no idea about customer service. Not one iota.

What I've seen, time and again, is a car manufacturer creating another problem after one of their fitters cocking a job up. The 'customer' is then expected to pay for it.
My job involves creating things that upto 175000 people might walk on in one weekend. I properly understand responsibility and I could not ever try to wriggle out of a 'mistake'. Invariably, mistakes end in prison sentences in my game.
I fail to see why car manufacturers should be treated any different.

I still don't get the "One side of the rear difflock has jammed on, creating the fault", when I only have a centre difflock fitted to the vehicle.

[tashtego]

Thanks for both answers.
I kinda feel that both answers are valid.
I'm not sure that they'd bodge it but I do think that they might forget bits.
I know not to use main dealers normally, I contribute a lot to one of the Mercedes-Benz forums and those main dealers have no idea about customer service. Not one iota.

What I've seen, time and again, is a car manufacturer creating another problem after one of their fitters cocking a job up. The 'customer' is then expected to pay for it.
My job involves creating things that upto 175000 people might walk on in one weekend. I properly understand responsibility and I could not ever try to wriggle out of a 'mistake'. Invariably, mistakes end in prison sentences in my game.
I fail to see why car manufacturers should be treated any different.

I still don't get the "One side of the rear difflock has jammed on, creating the fault", when I only have a centre difflock fitted to the vehicle.

Exactly. That's what I mean by 'bodge' it. I think they haven't assembled it correctly, otherwise it wouldn't have failed again so soon.
I was only a bystander/spanner boy while my mechanic was doing it, but I thought it was quite a fiddly job.
The rear diff lock jam is just a random thing they've come up with to cover their a***.

[Jameswallace]

My view is every dealer is different but ive yet to have a positive expereince with any main dealer

The work navara is in with a whining noise, consistent with speed but changes pitch with gear..

They came back and said it was thrust bearing, sent a video of the 'knackered' thrust bearing, which we went back and said sounded fine which it did, but nope they didnt listen, new clutch etc, put it back and just the same!!!! So now having a new gearbox! The most frustrating thing was it was explained that it had to be done by friday whatever, as it was going to poland, the reason it is last minute is also there fault as they first had it over a month ago but only just are doing it now!!

Luckily it is all covered under warentee the mechanic was very cocky and arogent and made a rather embaressed phone call to sa we where correct!

[shokenore]

I call dealer BS on this
They have fcuked up and now expect you to pay again for them to do the job again, hopefully this time they will get it right.
I would call them out on this and their explanation , get an independent mech to give you another opinion

Then go back to the dealer and get them to put it right and you ain't paying for it or the donuts and if they don't play ball mention one of the trade associations.....

[Triv]

I rang the indie Toyota specialist today in order to cancel the jobs he's doing tomorrow. I explained to him what had happened and he said exactly what you guys have said. The dealer fcuked it up.
Thanks guys, I feel better about it now but I'm still in limbo and carless. The dealer did say he'd let me know what their investigations showed up. They've been noticeably silent since, although 36hrs isn't a lifetime yet.

[KERRSURF]

I did rear seals on my 2nd gen, the bearings need pressed on properly, not a job you can afford to get wrong. the truck smelling of diff oil when you drove it should never have happened after they 'repaired' it.

[Triv]

So yesterday I went to visit the dealer as they've had the truck for a week and I've heard nothing from them.
They haven't even looked at it.
"It's due in the workshop today sir."

I don't like all this borrowing cars off mates palava. It costs a fortune in petrol!

[Karma Supra]

I only ever used a main dealer twice,

Once to change a clutch on a supra because I'd put my back out.
Second time for an "official" diagnostic to prove that the turbos I'd been sold were defective causing smoke.

The first time they sheered a bolt of the slave cylinder, causing the other one to snap on the way home, and it to fall off.

The second time they said "we don't know".

My most recent experience was to go with a friend, and look at buying used GT-86.

The sales rep was rude and ignorant, and wouldn't talk to her directly, (despite me saying its for her, not me) then made out if was out fault that they didn't have one in stock at a main dealership, as we'd not booked an appointment.

Their loss, she went for a fully loaded Cooper S instead.

Regarding the axle, I know in some cases the seal point on the axle shaft can be pitted with corrosion, and cause sealing issues (as do the output flanges on the transfer case). Any mechanic worth his salt would have pointed this out.

It's also possible that the hamfisted halfwit at the maid dealer either didn't put it back together properly, or scratched up the sealing surface trying to remove the seal.

I wouldn't expect it to get hot though, that implies its more of a wheel bearing issue.

[Triv]

No news today either.
I'm hoping that they're either hanging around hoping that I'll get fed up and take it away elsewhere, or that they're waiting for a part from Japan that I won't have to pay for...

Charlie's right.
I paid Toyota a lot of money to fix it. I expected it fixed. If there was another problem there, I would expect them to have told me about it and adjusted their quote accordingly. The same as every other business on the planet. I could then have made an informed decision.
Now, I feel as though I'm just waiting to find out exactly how much I'm going to be held to ransom for the repair of an ill performed job.
Jesus it sounds like Cowboy Builders!

Still on the positive side, this morning I had a fast 3 mile uphill walk to borrow a mate's rx8 Prodrive version.
I've stuck it round a few tracks in my time and I like it.

It's only 15 miles to work but I managed to burn up a quarter of a tank in that distance!
I don't think a few laps of Castle Coombe uses that much.

Has anyone got a fuel card I can borrow?

I just want my Surf back.
Fixed.
For free.

[Triv]

An hour ago I got just that. My surf back, fixed, for free!

Apparently the handbrake had jammed on, on one side and that was what the problem was.
I didn't realise that the handbrake jamming on would release such a volume of oil all over the hub/wheel/drum/wheel arch but then I understand the unwillingness to admit any liability for anything also. After all, have you followed any politics recently...

Anyway, it's back, I can get to work properly again and I dont feel as though I've just had a wire brush inserted anywhere unpleasant.

Thanks for letting me moan at you all.

I'm off to work.

[MacV8]

My conversation with my local Toyota Dealer (Canterbury) looked like this:
Me-Hello,I would like to get my injectors checked/replaced if necessary
Dealer-Off course sir,what car is it?
Me-2nd gen Surf,1kz-te
Dealer-Import?
Me-Yes
Dealer-There's the door,have a nice day

And that was it,on one other occasion I went to ask if they have Toyota branded 10w40 and they sent me to Halfords....

So yes...Avoid main dealers

[Triv]

The oil story is a bit strange.

I can understand them being reluctant to touch an import. After all, what with them being franchised to the largest vehicle manufacturer on Earth, it's not as if they've got access to all the information on any vehicle they build... Oh, hold on, that's b0ll0cks isn't it.

When I was in there the first time round, a chap came in and collected some oil he'd ordered earlier. Normal everyday punter, not a trade chap.
£22 odd he paid for 5L.
I spoke to the storeman afterwards and he said that yes it was cheap. Yes it was Toyota oil but it wasn't the same oil as they use in the workshop. He declined to tell me what oil they used in the workshop.