1KZTE Tuning

[Apache]

The ECU is the issue as it will always attempt to protect the engine if you go for more boost, and you need more boost to get enough air to burn the extra fuel.

Check your ECU and see if its an aftermarket one, as the standard Surf one is very old technology and not re-mappable to my knowledge. If you find a standard one, I suspect the original owner was pulling your plonker.

[TonyN]

I suspect the original owner was pulling your plonker.

The things people will do to close a deal....

[davec170]

Hi All!

Thanks Albannach for the other night - you were wonderful!



Just a few more thoughts and questions on tuning the mighty 1KZTE, for those who care...

When I got my Surf, as far as I can tell, it was mechanically standard apart from aftermarket wheels and a HUGE exhaust! This exhaust was 3" bore from the turbo, and terminated in the Japanese favourite: a 5" bore, slash cut back box. I've always disliked it, even more so after I did my body lift. It was so...

... Too noisy and too bling. Anyhoo, it was in good condition so I couldn't justify replacing it.

Until last Thursday. I took my Surf to a stainless steel fabricator (Custom craft in Elgin) and gave them the brief of "make it quieter and tuck it up further".

My truck exhaust now has a 2 1/4 internal diameter with one very large silencer in the middle - beautifully made and fitted.

Now to the crunch:

It's nice and quiet. It also still hits full boost (1 Bar) at under 2500 rpm. In fact it seems to hit full boost a couple of hundred rpm earlier! It feels quicker off the mark and also idles smoother. Early days, I know, but over the last 200 miles it seems to be using less fuel.

I realise that the reduction in overall noise can have a massive effect on perceived performance, however one other observtion appears to back up my initial feelings. Prior to the exhaust swap I had set my Bobbox up so that the engine produced some (black) smoke at full load and WOT (in theory, max power). Now, under the same conditions - no smoke.

I believe that I can up the fuelling/power should I wish. This leads me to a couple of questions for the Surf/diesel gurus:

What is the duration and valve overlap of a standard 1KZTE? I presume the exhaust valves start to open prior to BDC?

Do diesels benefit from some exhaust back pressure? - allowing
combustion to contiue to (or even after) BDC. A more complete burn would explain the quicker spool up and cleaner emissions.

The traditional wisdom on this site has always been "the bigger, the better" where exaust pipes are concerned. I know this is untrue for petrol 4-strokes unless valve timing/overlap/compression ratio is also optimised. Are 4-stroke diesels different?

A couple of other thoughts I'd like to add:

The ECU is the issue as it will always attempt to protect the engine if you go for more boost

Over boosting on a diesel without adding more fuel will not harm the core engine. It will not produce any more power either. In fact power will reduce as boost increases. The only damage likely to occur is split/blown off pressure hoses, burst intercooler or in extreme cases turbine wheel "disconnect"

I'd still like to fit an intercooler, I do think these are the best bang for your buck on a Surf.

Agree - they do make a real world difference but only once the vehicle has obtained a relatively high forward velocity. However, if Ben is looking to improve low down grunt for acceleration from slow/no speed driving conditions the effect is negligible. Without large volumes of air being forced through the cooler the cooling effect is minimal. In real driving conditions, the addition of an intercooler will reduce the impresion of low down torque. The volume of air in the cooler increases lag, so raising the rpm at which maximum boost is achieved when the engine is asked to accelerate rapidly. The situation is worse with some top mount coolers as they become inter-warmers when stationary!

In my garage, I have a full water-methanol injection set up off my last car. If I wanted to increase power output of my Surf significantly I would fit it.
This has the ability to cool the intake charge regardless of vehicle speed, reduce turbo lag, reduce EGTs and supply extra fuel if required. It is also easy to fit as it doesn't have the packaging issues of an air/air intercooler.

Water-methanol is real value for money, but you have to do your reseach - there's a lot of sh*t talked on the internet...

....I should know!

[MWS]

[QUOTE=davec170;674078]Hi All!

Thanks Albannach for the other night - you were wonderful!



Just a few more thoughts and questions on tuning the mighty 1KZTE, for those who care...

there's a lot of sh*t talked on the internet...





.............................. ............Had'nt noticed..........Cheers....Mick.

[Ben_D]

Check your ECU and see if its an aftermarket one, as the standard Surf one is very old technology and not re-mappable to my knowledge. If you find a standard one, I suspect the original owner was pulling your plonker.

The ECU is standard but the was remapped by Viezu, they re wrote some of the files in there but not as yet sure what. Sent them a mail and will give them a call if I hear nothing by mid week. Previous owner told me they found the ECU a bit of a limitation, has anyone fitted or could recommend an aftermarket system?

Dave, some of the Aussie sites reckon a 3" system is about optimal but the biggest limitation is the dump pipe, did you have this changed or fabricated when you had the exhaust done? They are available from Oz but very expensive for a short piece of bent pipe.

Intersting what you say about the intercooler, could there be other options here, other aftermarket coolers?

Cheers

Ben

[Xray]

well that was one descussion .i'm not that tech but apart from injectors as in spray pattern and volume turbo size ecu remap and a good exhaust should give a good return if all of those things can be done? at a affordable price on a motor that is almost 2 ton or more
i feel out of my depth have thought about doing somthing to my truck its clamed to be 145 standard

[davec170]

I have standard cast turbo elbow fitted. If I was trying to make the flow better than it was with the old massive bore system fitted, them a custom dump pipe would have been the way to go - as it was the most restrictive part.

With my new system on, the elbow is a larger internal diameter than the down stream pipework. I think my Surf now goes better.

If you unbolted the standard dump pipe/elbow casting and left it off there would be no restriction. Conventional theories would suggest this would give maximum performance (though noisy!)

I think the lack of any back pressure would allow unburnt fuel to escape through the exhaust valves during valve overlap - reducing efficiency and power.

Optimum exhaust design must lie somewhere between a blocked pipe and no pipe! I just posted my feelings/findings.


Coolers.... Only my thoughts again:

Front mounted (FMIC) better than top mount. Air to Air will increase efficiency/power once vehicle is travalling at speed.

Air to Water charge coolers more efficient and able to cool to a certain extent whilst stationary. However they need their own radiator/fan/pump/plumbing (water, air and wiring). They weigh more, are difficult to package (into Surf - not on about posting) and if the heat exchanger developes a water leak into the inlet section - Bang!. They are also expensive.

Water/water-methanol injection:

Read some of the stuff on here:

http://www.coolingmist.com/

There is a forum there - so not all company biased.

You really have to decide where/when you need/want the extra power, then decide if the extra cost is worth the gain.


I still think that even if you find another 20%, right across the rev range, you will soon get used to it. You'll still not have a "quick" vehicle.

[Apache]

The ECU is standard but the was remapped by Viezu, they re wrote some of the files in there but not as yet sure what.

I have a 3.0 ECU in bits in the shed. I dont recall thinking anything in it is 'writeable' (I'll check, but I remember it being pretty basic). So again, I would take what you've been told with a pinch of salt.

DaveC - totally agree re. FMIC, though you'll struggle to get agreement from folk on here - they prefer an interwarmer. Also agree re. water - air chargecooler, and I reckon the ST165 / 185 / 205 Celica setups would fit easily.

[Predictable Bob]

have thought about doing somthing to my truck its clamed to be 145 standard

The intercooled 3.0 diesel is 145bhp the normal 3.0 diesel is 130 IIRC

[yoshie]

Ben the key thing is weight.

I had a visit fro gwh200 and Albannach a few months back when I was building my Jimny.



Both suggested a cracking weight saving mod for my surf. I am not daft, those guys sometimes can be very much the joker, so I checked with Apache and Tony before I made the mod.

I reckon I get about 80bhp more and about 10mpg more now.




Best of all it's so cheap to do, I got it on specail for 2 for £2


Not sure if other flavours give the save performance, the guys might know.

[BUSHWHACKER]

The intercooled 3.0 diesel is 145bhp the normal 3.0 diesel is 130 IIRC

150 bhp from the 2.7 PETROL.

[Apache]

150 bhp from the 2.7 PETROL.

...and potential for 1000bhp.

Forget it Vince. You'll never convince these luddites

[JUDWAK]

how much for you to fit that mod on mine yoshie?

[Ben_D]

Ben the key thing is weight.

I had a visit fro gwh200 and Albannach a few months back when I was building my Jimny.

Both suggested a cracking weight saving mod for my surf. I am not daft, those guys sometimes can be very much the joker, so I checked with Apache and Tony before I made the mod.

I reckon I get about 80bhp more and about 10mpg more now.

Best of all it's so cheap to do, I got it on specail for 2 for £2


Not sure if other flavours give the save performance, the guys might know.

Very good, reckon the performance gains would be better from Stella tins with the ends removed, prob lighter too!!

Ben

[Ben_D]

Apache / Dave,

Will have a look into FMIC, away to see a friend next week who is a lot more of a luddite than me (knows a shitload more about diesels). Any thoughts on location and suitable cooler?

Cheers

Ben